Lendl is running scared for his boy.

I'd go as far as to say that, as long as rafa doesn't have any setbacks, he's a strong favourite for RG again, marginally ahead of an on-song nole. I also predicted before the acapulco final that rafa would make a big statement against clay court specialist ferrer. I also know that rafa is a past IW champ.
HOWEVER, I take none of these things as indicators that rafa should be expected to go deep into this event. I think the organisers fixed the draw to get rafa against roger in the QFs, because it's a huge seller and they know the QFs are as far as they can confidently expect rafa to go in his first h/c event back. I don't think ivan's being partisan - he's too emotionally detached and stoic to make judgements based on emotion - and I think his caution is realistic.
What would be ironic would be if rafa made it to the QFs but roger didn't - what a bummer for the organisers that would be!

If Rafa beats Fed in the final, who in Ferru's qtr could stop him from getting to the final.

Under normal circumstances, if it were down to ability absolutely no one could ... but in this, rafa's first h/c event in goodness knows how long, he could be big bird's (boooo!) for the taking.

My humble advice to rafans at ehis very early stage of his general recovery on h/c is aim low and treat every win as a bonus. Even though you quietly want to see him take out roger in the QFs, act like you don't expect it, and then celebrate if he does ;)

^^^I'll do my best to take your advice. I shall try and contain myself.

"Lendl, a former No. 1, is convinced that anyone out side of the top four (Djokovic, Federer, Murray and Spain's David Ferrer) would be hard-pressed to win a Grand Slam title this season."

This, I simply don't understand. Rafa, if he maintains this form, is a favorite for at least RG, not Ferrer. I don't want to underestimate Ferrer's achievements, but I do not think he is a future slam champion. He only managed one masters title (Paris) and that because a lot of things going into his favor fell in the place. Sure, a win is a win (similarly, Nole's win in Toronto) but the other four guys have amassed a huge number of masters not to mention slams for a reason. It would be refreshing to see him win a slam however, I would say that DelPo has more chances.

Lendl, scared? lol

Obviously Lendl meant Rafa instead of Ferrer in the top four. Berdych over Rafa? Not on this IW court, because wind is the factor here, and we know how poorly Berdych deals with the wind. It's no wonder he did poorly at IW. I believe Berdych has better chances at Miami, having reached the final there in 2010, beating Fed along the way but losing to Roddick in the end.

How Rafa fares depends on how he plays in the first few rounds; if his knee is Ok after the first few testings, he'll gain confidence and may play freely afterwards. The SF between Fed and Rafa last year, everyone thought the wind was the factor in Rafa losing but I disagree. Rafa wasn't playing well at IW last year, his knee was already having problem after that long AO final. Rafa can deal with the wind better than anyone else, Fed included. Remember his IW final win against Murray in 2009? The windy conditions back then was even worst than last year but Rafa handled it as if there's no wind! Not to take anything away from Fed's win, for Fed was playing well enough to beat Rafa, and Fed himself was also ill during that IW tournament (credit to him for winning the whole thing, beating on fire Bellucci and Raonic and Isner!)

racquet , 3/7/13 1:28 AM

LOL - yes perhaps people don't remember the great Lendl - its all about Rafa or so I heard.

^^^You really believe that Lendl is greater than Rafa?

Oh wait! Lendl won his first slam at 24, Rafa won his at 19.

nadline, regardless of whether Lendl is greater than Rafa or not, I like your wittiness in handling the questions thrown at you. You really have your way of dealing with tricky questions/ situations!

Nope I don't think Lendl is greater than Nadal. I just happen to like Lendl more.

Thanks, lucky.

Nope I don't think Lendl is greater than Nadal. I just happen to like Lendl more.
samprallica, 3/7/13 10:32 AM

Just as well there is no accounting for taste.

Surely you aren't a shot at my preferences for players? I happen to like Nadal, except that there are a few I place above him in my list. Lendl is one of them that's all.

"Oh wait! Lendl won his first slam at 24, Rafa won his at 19..."

Then it is clear that Becker and Wilander are better than either of them!
Not.
hohohooo
Just because Rafa flattened a underperforming Ferrer all of a sudden everyone `is running scared`. Rafa hasn't nibbled on a HC title in 2.5 years and is coming back from seven months out! I would be surprised, nay astonished, if either part of fedal won this tournament. But out of the 2 Federer has the best (small) chance in this particular event. Only Andy has a decent chance to stop Novak taking this, short of an upset.
Perspective please.

^^ Lol, I was wondering where you were all this time.

Nadal was good but I don't really see much that would cause Lendl, let alone his student lose sleep over.

You are right Twinge. Who can argue with you with your got the top of the range crystal ball from Poundland.

samprallica, who would be so presumptuous to even think that Rafa has anything to worry the great Muzz!

"Nadal was good"

ooh, that's an interesting choice of tense there samps ;)

"Who can argue with you with your got the top of the range crystal ball from Poundland"

Thank you, & you're correct (for once), no one should argue with me. And oh
its from ASDA actually ;)

Oh, Asda! That's a limited edition.

You could make yourself a fortune as you are able to see into the future so accurately.

^^I've enough money.
Clearly Poundland is where you get your sense of sarcasm from nags.
And your debating skills straight from the discount shelf at Oxfam.

Twinge, no one is expecting Rafa to do anything at IW so don't fret, relax.

I'm perfectly tranquilo nagline,
It's you that can get all het up about this sort of thing,
And that we both know.

Every knows that Andy is da man.

more sarcasm :(
although it doesn't mean you are wrong you know :)

I wouldn't go that far to say that Ivan is afraid for his little boy...but he certainly is intimidated and he is playing mind games with Rafa and his team?he must be thinking: it was so much easier without Rafa in the equation. Didn't Andy say the same thing a while ago when asked about Rafa's comeback...he was stating that it may take a while for Rafa to come back to his top form which on one hand is fair assessment but on the other hand it is the way for Andy to release the pressure from his burdened shoulders ?they would all like to see Rafa?s confidence shaken?as Cheryl so beautifully pointed out in one of her posts: confident Rafa is almost impossible to beat...Having Rafa back is great for tennis: tennis needs him as much as he needs tennis!
Vamos Rafa!

"but he certainly is intimidated and he is playing mind games with Rafa and his team.."

Im not just saying this but i dont believe lendl is in any way intimidated by rafa or playing mind games, it is an honest assessment, nothing more & it seems spot on too.
Mind games are a fedal trait.
Roger plays them with others, and Nadal plays them on himself.
Why does Andy have burdened shoulders anyway?
If Nadal is no longer in Andy's head and he has had a break from that for quite some time i dont think nadal will be a problem anywhere but on clay and, perhaps wimbledon.
And that is my honest assessment :)
its not just rafa that can find a way back from a line of straight defeats you know.
Rafa has not played any of the top 3 so far it shall be interesting to say the least to see how he fares to say the least.

Lol reading these comments! Lendl said, "It's a little bit early to judge." From that people deduced that Ivan is scared on Andy's behalf! Give me a break.
One of the things that I really love about Lendl is that he keeps his cards so very close when discussing anything to do with Andy.

"confident Rafa is almost impossible to beat..."

I think you will find that is true of all of the top 4 as it is not an isolated emotion.
Dont believe me? then i advise you to hop on the nearest time machne BACK to 2011.
;)

Rafa must be relishing the negative expectations. He never enjoyed too much attention as the favourite so the pressure is on everyone else.

When Rafa and Ferru were expected to meet in the Acapulco final, the thought was that Ferru would be his sternest test since coming back from injury, it was said that Ferru was on form having won 19 straight matches. Rafa went into the match as the underdog and showed them what he is made of. Suddenly, Ferru was 'under performing'.

You just have to laugh. Yea, let me laugh. Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

One of the things that I really love about Lendl is that he keeps his cards so very close when discussing anything to do with Andy.
deuce, 3/7/13 2:49 PM

He wasn't keeping them too close in that interview, was he. He believes that Rafa can't beat three of the current top 4 in a row because it's never been done before. You have to laugh.

No, of course Lendl is not scared of Rafa. Why should anyone be scared of lowly Rafa when they've got the great Andy Murray in their charge.

"Rafa has not played any of the top 3 so far"...the list is shorter every time...In Acapulco Rafa was almost sentenced to a big loss from No 4 Ferrer and when he demolished him people were saying Ferrer was out of sorts?! C'mon people! How much does it take for Rafa to get credit for his fantastic performance?
And this time around when he beats Fed people will say "but Rafa has not played No1 yet, we are yet to see how he fares"...that's ridiculous...

Twinge, 3/7/13 2:53 PM
No!
Confident Rafa vs. confident Andy means Rafa wins because Rafa is the better player...simple as that...confident Rafa vs. confident Fed? Well, wasn't Fed always SO confident in his encounters with Rafa and yet he has such a poor H2H with Rafa...and confident Rafa vs.confident Nole on hard courts is close and it can go either way?that is my honest assessment?:)

"Suddenly, Ferru was 'under performing'."

More dumb sarcasm.
But ferrer WAS underperforming and is a bog standard pidgeon for nadal in any instance.
Okay then he's back and he is the actual Number 1 etc, believe that if you want.
But i will believe it when I SEE IT personally speaking.

No!
Right back at ya sweet cheeks!
Rafa WAS the better player historically speaking and will always be on clay i think we can safely say, but on HCs going on?
No sorry, confidence was an issue for Andy and it was to the benefit of Nadal among others. But one can only be a debutant for so long.
When was there are `confident rafa against a confident Murray` anyway?
Maybe the one time was toronto and Andy won, no other time really.
The Andy Rafa meets on the HC next time shall be a different player and the better player too.
Rafa is `close` to Novak on HC?
yeah right....

Andy shall soon come out from under the psychological rock that is fedal, as Novak has.
The AO semi & the Olympics was a sign that he is starting to do it (under Lendls guidance) and when he does...
SHOWTIME!

Twinge, is Rafa worth all the time you spend trying to dismiss him. If he was that irrelevant you wouldn't be wasting your time on him, would you? Surely if Rafa was so outclassed by Murray, Nole and Fed no one would be paying any attention to him.

Rafa is the one player who threatens the legacy of the other 3, that's why he is the subject of nearly every tennis blog on the internet. That is the true, no?

well, I heard those stories of Andy before...he was destined to win at least two Wimbies and three USOs and two AOs so far and we all know where he stands at the moment...please don't speak of Andy as he was so much younger than Rafa...if I did not know better I would think that Andy is reaching his peak right now (at his what 25? soon to be 26?), but is he? Well, we can only speculate...one HC GS without Rafa in the equations gives me no argument that Andy is capable of beating Rafa in GS! We can put it this way to relax you a bit: your certainty on Andy beating Rafa is equal to my certainty on Rafa beating Nole..so that makes us even...we will stick around to see what happens and who was right...:)

Who spends all their time discussing Nadal? lol
Nadline your childlike attempts to distort every discussion are as unconvincing to me
as they are to everyone else with a brain.
I dont spend so much time discussing him, this is a Murray related thread too remember.
I know that to you there are only 2 kinds of tennis fans; Nadal fans and those that are in denial about being Nadal fans, but your nadal induced solipsism is very wrong headed.
I think that Novak threatens Rafa's legacy far more in that, to the thankful fed fans,
he destroyed Nadals chance to threaten their so called `goat`.

I can't remember the last time Andy wasn't the favourite for a GS title apart from the FO. But this year, he's moved up again as he is joint favourite for RG with Nole. The fact that he's never won a clay title in his life is neither here nor there, but Rafa not winning a h/c title for 2.5 years really counts against him, no matter he's made s few
GS h/c finals in that time.

You just have to laugh.

if I did not know better I wokuld think that Andy is reaching his peak right now (at his what 25? soon to be 26?).."

Well clearly you dont know better as he is just reaching his peak,
How many more more matches has Nadal palyed than Andy again?
300 400? Oh but he is only a year older than Andy and Novak so no doubt he's got another 5 years at the top, with bionic knoees no doubt ;)

Anyway, Rafa is wowing the crowds at IW.

At the Madison Sq Gdns echo, the reporter asked Rafa '"Did you realize how much your fans missed you?" -Rafa: "I think I missed them more than they missed me." !!!

But this year, he's moved up again as he is joint favourite for RG with Nole.

Thats ROT hahaha,
I agree that he gets hyped too much on his chances but give the boy a little more time he is getting there.
Oh and nadal has had plenty of slams without having a nemesis there (or anyone of note apart from punchbag federer) although hes never had one without having nadal there to be sure.

Twinge, you make me laugh. Is that an admission that neither Murray or Nole could be seen as Rafa's nemesis?

Wilander has already tipped Nole or Andy for RG. When Rafa was told, his response was that you don't have to be the favourite to win. Got it in one.

The last time I check, that AO final in 2012 was the last time Rafa/Nole met on the hard court, and true enough it was close, at least closer than the AO final this year between Nole/Murray. Rafa was closer to beating Nole at the AO than Murray was this year.

Murray's level on hard courts was so up and down, it's hard to say for sure a confident Murray can now beat a confident Rafa on the hard court. The last time they met on the hard court, ie Tokyo Open final in 2011, was Rafa confident? He was struggling to beat Fish, Giraldo; I didn't see a confident Rafa to be honest.

A confident Murray did beat Fed at Shanghai, and AO this year, but he also lost to Fed at WTF last year. Rafa is a tougher opponent for Murray than Fed is, so I simply don't think that from now on, Murray will beat Rafa more often than Rafa beat him on the hard courts, unless Rafa can't get back to his previous good level.

Twinge, 3/7/13 3:46 PM
no, you misunderstood me...my reference to their age is only for the sake of Andy growing up mentally...so you think at his 26 Andy finally has no fears and is confident enough to beat Rafa? Why would you think is that? Andy has 1 GS and he is mentally stronger than Rafa who has 11 GS titles?! Next time they meet Andy will do WHAT?! On what basis can you even speculate that Andy would beat Rafa? I understand your personal preference but to say that Andy has a different aura right now is just (let me use Ivan's words) "It's a little bit early to judge" ;)

As far as Twinge is concerned, it's all jam tomorrow for Andy.

"Wilander has already tipped Nole or Andy for RG"

Which means NOTHING. lol.
No I do not think he has no fears etc i am saying that compared to Rafa Andy Murray was an immature player but like everyone else he has learned and will conitunue grow. its not rocket science any of this it is common sense.
Murray was POOR and whiney against Rafa at the USO that was clear to see (although the scheduling did not help) is he always going to be the same as that? I refuse to believe that particularly when one takes a look at his progress over the last 6 months alone.
You can all go on and say well rafa beat murray so many times but even earlier they were pretty level on HC and the way i see it Andy has more potential than rafa at this stage so yes i could be wrong but we will have to see.
And Luckstar we were clearly referring to the nadal rafa match up NOT the fed Murray one & i do not beleive he was confident at the WTF as he buckled 2nd set in a way Novak did not.
All of these players are at a more advanced level of their careers.
Andy Murray is still not there (& yes the clock is ticking).

As far as nagline is concerned, it's all jam tomorrow for Nadal.

^^^Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

"Rafa was closer to beating Nole at the AO than Murray was this year..."

But Rafa hasn't actually BEATEN Novak on a HC at all since 2010!
Also where were the MPs last time that made this so close, so even stevens, really?
Im sorry but it really is milking it to say he is close on HC.
Also Murrays game collapsed and anyway you could also say that had he taken the 2nd set then he could have won it etc blah blah. But he didnt.
It is rubbish to say that Nadal is 50/50 with Novak on HCs.
Until he does it ofcourse.
And that certainly remains to be seen.

How would Murray do better against Rafa when he was already so up and down against Fed, someone he beat more often than being beaten? Rafa is a more difficult opponent for Murray than Fed or Nole is, even on the hard courts. As I said, unless Rafa can't get back to his previous good level, there's no proof at this point that Murray will be the better player each time they meet on the hard courts.

"the way i see it Andy has more potential than rafa at this stage so yes i could be wrong but we will have to see."
Twinge, 3/7/13 4:10 PM


Jam tomorrow!

There is evidence, however, that Andy will play better than before.
Because he is (now pay attention ladies) IMPROVING as a player. honestly its not that difficult to grasp what i am saying, he is also a more aggressive player than before.
And I did not also say that Murray will be the better player each and every time. This is a strawman argument that i would expect from nagline Luckystar.
I get it that Nadal fans often like Andy as he panders to them and plays dead nicely for their idol's aggrandisement, im just saying that it might not be such a cosy thing going on and my reasons are solid for this whether you absorb them or not or whether you think they will make a difference.

"Jam tomorrow!"

And the next day & the next
oh and the one after too!
;)

Er.. I'm sure I'm not the one who said that Rafa is 50/50 vs Nole on the hard courts. Rafa was injured during second half of 2012 so there's no way for us to know how he would fare against Nole on the hard courts then.

Murray's game collapsed during the AO? Or he's not confident against Fed during WTF? So all the more confirmed what I said about him, that his game is/was so up and down even on the hard courts, so I'm not sure he won't be up and down when facing Rafa on the hard courts too!

No it doesnt. Were his feet disgusting or his leg hamstrung at the AO because they lost confidence?
Generally you could also say that a levelling out process is another stage of Andys improvement he must make but it is not as bad as you are making out now for sure.
This is the emotional levelling out that is part of the maturing process really buy one has to go through the hoops it cannot be faked,
ie beat Fed in a slam
win a slam etc.
So we cant be sure but one should not rely on it as an opponent going on i would say would be a prudent expectation.

"Er.. I'm sure I'm not the one who said that Rafa is 50/50 vs Nole on the hard courts"

Sorry i was killing 2 birds with one stone ;)

I honestly like Murray...I think he is a great person and I believe he has so much more to offer as a tennis player and he will...But I also think Rafa would be a bad match up for Andy even if Andy was confident enough...Sure, their matches in the future will be close but I will always give the edge to Rafa provided Rafa is not injured...an injured Rafa is no match to anyone (just remember Rosol) and there is no point making any comparisons...
I really like watching great tennis...Andy can play very well and be a real treat for our "tennis eyes" but I hate when he turns out defensive, the same thing I dislike in Rafa from time to time (although let's be clear: defense is not always a bad thing just has to be rationally employed :)
We are fans and supporters of our players and we will believe in what we want and wish to believe...that's the beauty of being a fan...I enjoyed talking to you, Twinge. Murray is lucky to have a fan like you...I really mean it...I hope Andy believes in himself as much as you believe in him?
let us enjoy this IW...It would be great to see Andy vs. Rafa final...:) ok.ok...I am dreaming now, am I...

^^Cool thanks Nats, the feeling is reciprocated.
And yes i wish great things for Andys style of tennis (when he isnt playing very defensively, that is).
Anyhoo we are all speculating and perhaps i was being a little (more than) too rash to say that Rafa won't trouble Andy on HCs going on ;)
We can disagree witthout being too disagreeable no?
Lets just see how it will unfold.

The main thing is, Rafa is in the mix. After 7 months of anxiety not knowing when we would see him play again, it's great just to see his name in the draw. Who knows how he'll do, not even he does.

Only a complete twit would be predicting Andy to win RG. More lols. However, Wimbles, now that's a whole different ball game.

"He believes that Rafa can't beat three of the current top 4 in a row because it's never been done before. You have to laugh."
nadline, 3/7/13 3:01 PM

That's not what he believes at all. He says "anyone out side of the top four" can't beat three of the current top 4 in a row. Fully comprehending the article before mocking it would help.

Rafa is outside the top 4 isn't he?

Yes, and I'm sure Lendl thinks Ferrer will remain in the top 4, especially after Acalpulco. Come on. He's too savvy for that and you should be too.

You don't know what Lendl thinks, do you?

^^ Says the person who claimed Lendl was running scared. LOL.

^^ just what I was thinking samps.....;)
re our other conversation re Andy, think it's really difficult to change your style of play. Remember Andy dramatically changing how he played, losing against Nalby, mid match. He won. Have also seen him start out really aggressively against Rafa, only to fall apart and revert back to normal.
Only wish he would start to believe in his aggressive game, rather than relying on his defensive game. That gets him out of trouble against most players, but not against top 6.

Patterns can only be changed with a proactive mental process if the realization isn't enough. Perhaps a dialogue or something; I have actually seen juniors use trigger words such as "come on" to start a point with attacking intent from the start and it works beautifully. Surely something similar can be figured out for Andy - although I've noticed he does use "come on" himself of late.

samps, his practise T shirt now bears the legend "Prepare, Attack, Destroy" perhaps Ivan is getting him to say that at crucial moments? As fans we can only travel hopefully.

nadline just gave her opinion that Lendl was running scared. That is not the same as presuming to know what Lendl thinks (as racquet did).

^^^Thanks holdserve. At least someone can see the difference.

deuce, it is said that to travel hopefully is better than to arrive. Lol

Here's another one: Better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all. lol.

@ nadline
When Andy won the Olympic Gold and USOpen all his fans "arrived."

natashao, 3/7/13 5:08 PM

natashao: I think you've said it all in that comment, and very well. Fully agree.

deuce, you deserved it. Your journey was long and frustrating.

^^ Are u sure? Or is it all that pent up 7 months that is causing you to spew on like this?

For Muzzans

http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Media/Videos/Uploaded/20 13/3/8/Indian-Wells-2013-Player-Party-Andy-Murray-Fleming-Rojer.aspx

Photos: Fashion hits & misses at the Indian Wells Players Party
FRIDAY, MARCH 08, 2013 /BY JONATHAN SCOTT
Print

The biggest names in tennis?sans those who go by Williams?were on hand for the BNP Paribas Open players party in Indian Wells, California, last night. The star-studded affair included the likes of Novak Djokovic, Rafael Nadal, Victoria Azarenka, and many more. As this tournament is considered "the fifth Grand Slam" event by many, a number of players and their companions did it up a little more as their attire was concerned. Here are my favorite appearances, all the hits and misses (you can see the photos here, at Tennis Panorama):

Best Look (female): Ana Ivanovic?that rouge lipstick set off her shiny black outfit quite well, so striking and with accent-colored red clutch.

Best Look (male): Rafael Nadal?the on-the-up star just flat-out looks debonair, in a better-tailored jacket than basically everyone else (save Roger Federer's common cuts).

Fashion Yawner: Novak Djokovic?he so often errs on the side of too conservative with his looks, considering his formidable, outsized presence and personality, and how he expresses himself on court. It seeems he's too earnest with his style and wishing to appear Federer-ian and elegant, but the white shirt under a brown sweater just puts onlookers in a sartorial coma.

See more on

http://www.tennis.com/pro-game/2013/03/photos-fashion-hits-misse s-indian-wells-players-party/46718/#.UTowSFdX62s

Hope Andy was wearing his kilt, that'd shake those fashionistas up......but doubt it somehow....

^^^^deuce, see my link @ nadline, 3/8/13 8:32 PM

Players turn the soil at IW extension

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=y Gk-UOc7mUo

Cheers nadline, Ana I. looked beautiful didn't she? Lol Andy and Mike Myers...what was he doing there????