it will b good 2 c del po bak cos i wanna c rafa play him again when both of them are fully fit cos im sure rafa will give him a beat down as he used 2 do b4 he started 2 feel his body give way. but i like del po da best from da big hitters so wish him da best.

Even if Delpo can be back by the USO, he won't be match fit. Like Rafa last year after his return from injury and got beatdowns from the top ten players, I expect Delpo to face with the same fate. If he meets Rafa, expect a beat down from Rafa. Well may be that is pay back time, and justice will prevail. No more of 'Delpo owning Rafa' talks anymore, I think. Seriously, after watching Rafa handling both Berdych and Sod and dispatching them handily, I think Rafa can deal with Delpo too even if Delpo is a bigger hitter than both Berdych and Sod. Rafa just has to use the right strategy, and not trying to outhit Delpo like what Fed tried to do but failed.

nice. the good news for del potro is that agassi had a wrist injury and still became an eight time slam champion. Most champions mature at around 22,I expect Del Potro to mature at around 23-24 now due to his injury. He has PLENTY of room for improvement. I think if he fully recovers,he can become a multiple champion at the USO,and maybe Australia.

btw,i think that by Wimbly/USO next yr,Delpo is back to his best. And on a fast hard court,he can beat anyone on his day. I think Gulbis ccould be his main rival,as they are around the same age and are similarily talented. (this is is a few years of course)

luckystar: Rafa beat Soderling and Berdych on grass, not fast hardcourts. HUGE difference. Rafa's game does not adapt as well on Deco-turf, and most of the beat downs he's suffered throughout his career have come on fast hardcourts. So I expect the Nadal-Delpo match @ UsOpen (if it happens) far from a foregone conclusion. If Delpo is fit, he would surely have the edge.

When Nadal is playing well, he is nearly unbeatable on clay and extremely hard to beat on grass. On hardcourts, however, several players (Murray, Djokovic, Del Potro, Federer, Davydenko etc) can beat Rafa at his A game (as we saw in AO 2010 QF). One of the big reasons is that Nadal has an edge in movement on clay and grass over other players. On hardcourts, NOT so much.

I really do think Nadal has to make several adjustments to succeed on faster hardcourts and the USOpen. The return of serve (ROS) and the slice are the worst parts of his game. The ROS really gets exposed on Deco turf; Rafa stands too far back to accommodate his extreme western forehand grips while taking a good cut at the ball. That's a recipe for disaster. I can't recall the million times Delpo just killed Rafa's short returns last year.

So Nadal needs to stand up closer to the baseline and chip/block serves on his forehand (and to be fair he's done that in Wimb. for the past several yrs, but he never seems to carry it to NYC in the UsOpen).

I would also like to see Nadal improve his slice. Since he does not get enough time to hit his double handed backhand on hardcourts, Rafa slices much more and the ball just sits up (as the courts do not take spin). Same thing with Rafa's forehand which does not penetrate the court enough and the spin becomes ineffective.

Of course Nadal is making some adjustments, not least hitting a flatter forehand and endeavoring to be more aggressive.

All that said, I think he still needs to do MUCH more to win at Flushing, NY this year (or in the future).

When Rafa returned to the tour last year he not only wasn't match fit but he had that abdomen tear to deal with. It's very normal for a player to develop an additional injury if they're coming back from a long lay off. Naturally, Rafa was also quite low on confidence (from his recurring knee injury injury, not being 100% and having not won a title for so long). It's the same with most players - Gasquet, Simon, Nalby, etc - they need time to readjust and Delpo will be no different. It will be a good time for Rafa to try to exploit the situation while he's riding on a high confidence and (hopefully) fully fit although his knee problems could occur any moment. I think the player who could give Rafa more trouble will be Murray, Djoker and Cilic.

There'll be a lot of pressure/expectation on Delboy if he comes back to defend his title. Better for him to ease back with the Davis cup. Mind you he has massive points to defend so perhaps that comes into the equation.
imjimmy: rafa has sais USOpen is his target. Do not underestimate his will..
remi: hi! Good 2 c u back and posting regularly! But where is darling fan4t these days?

well these are just rumours, delpo might return or might not..time will tell.

@imjimmy, you have made good points there but there are more things to cover. U are right rafa's sliced bh often gets him in trble as the ball sits up on the hard courts,BUT he has improved that shot a lot as complimented by murray and federer. he hits kinda two 'types' , one that isnt cut through the ball and hit sort of underneath the ball so doesnt get much penetration (this slice is mostly hit when he is far behind the baseline and the ball is falling) , the other is the one he stabs through and that one gets plenty of bite and sets u the pt (this one is hit whe standing near the baseline and the ball is rising) ..so if the court positioning is aggressive , i.e standing near the baseline he can hit good slices.

as per the ROS and forehand, well,i always say his ROS is an underrated shot , ppl say its weak and only his RETURN GAME is strong but not the return of serve.. grass is the fastest surface and when rafa employs an aggressive position his ROS is ONE OF THE BEST, take a look at this, federer rarely got his serve broken in the 2007 wimb and 2008 wimb but rafa broke his serve 3 times in 2007 and 4 times in 2008!
this year, berdych lost serve only ONCE in his matches against fed and nole ! rafa broke his serve 4 times in 3 sets, soderling suffered similar fate and rafa returnted serve BETTER than ferrer did, u can watch both matches and compare.

true, he can drop the ball short and get into trble, he is standind too far back and those big whips dont pay much dividence as the ball lands so short only to be punished by powerful baseliners.BUt when rafa is so confident his court positioning really changes. notice that his confidence and court positioning on hard courts are in direct relationship. For e.g, he won Oz 09 by playing the best he had ever done on a hard court and then he went to play rotterdam.Rotterdam's conditions are even faster than the conditions in NY , surely... but look at rafa's court positioning when returning serve in those matches, he stood close to the baseline and in the final against muzza he attacked 2nd serves from the very first game. nadal is tactically really smart, he is fully aware of his weaknesses and knows how to find a way. just look how much angry and frustrated he gets when he gets punished on a short return ! , when rafa is able to play full-time aggressive tennis on hard courts he can BEAT ANYBODY , just look what he did to davy in the first set of doha, rafa's forehand had depth and pace so davy was clueless! when rafa's forehand has depth its IMPOSSIBLE to take it on the rise becoz the ball is incrediably heavy and erratic at that time...

rafa is a man on the mission, he wants US open badly and if not this year may b later, he is gona win it, i am sure. he won olympic gold on deco turf so no qs he can win there. his serve is also better now, toronto and cincy will give us a good idea. cant wait..

imjimmy, sometimes I couldn't help but think that you thought you know better than Rafa on the tennis court. Do you think whatever you mentioned above, Rafa does not know about them? Didn't you see that Rafa has been making adjustments to his game, and that include adjusting his positions at the baseline according to surfaces?

You brought out those defeats that Rafa suffered on the hard courts, but do you realized that many of the recent ones are due to his injury of 2009? In fact if you watch that AO 2010 QF match between Rafa and Murray, you'll notice Rafa had the upper hand at the beginning of set one and two. He was the one who broke serves first and he played aggressively all the time. Murray had to resort to his excellent first serves and even S & V on his second serves to bail himself out of troubles. The thing that was missing in Rafa's game was his confidence, as evident from the fact that he couldn't serve aces during crunch times to save himself when facing break points. Do you notice that at RG and Wimbledon 2010, when his confidence was back, his serves were hardly broken? Murray only broke him once during the Wimbledon SF & Berdych couldn't even break him once! Mind you, Delpo handed a beat down to Rafa at the USO last year because Rafa couldn't even serve at his normal level (due to his abdominal muscle tear). I'm sure Rafa won't be beaten 6-2,6-2,6-2 had he been healthy; Delpo most probably had to go the distance to beat Rafa!

Why not wait for the show down between Rafa and the likes of Nole/Murray/Berdych/Sod at the US hard courts to see how Rafa fare against them? I'll give Davy/Delpo till next year when they fully regain their form to see how they fare against a top form Rafa. I'm confident a healthy Rafa will be able to beat them on fast hard courts. I won't say he'll dominate over them, like Fed did during his prime, but Rafa can edge out wins over them, of course not 100% of the time.

This is GOOD NEWS indeed! :) I have missed seeing this giant play.

tj, I think if you are talking about in few years time, you have to include Cilic too! Frankly I'm more impressed with Cilic's game than Delpo's. What Delpo has is raw power. You also have to include both Nole and Murray, as the two are only one year older then the trio of Delpo, Gulbis and Cilic. Also Rafa is not much older.

I believe Rafa can own the clay and grass courts for a few more years, and have a fair share of slow hard courts, and occasional wins on the fast hard courts too, as long as he has no injury issues! That's why I'm optimistic that Rafa can rule for maybe two to three years, dominating on clay and grass, though his rule may not be as long as Fed's. During Fed's 'rule', he seemed more dominant as he could dominate on hard courts, which formed the bulk of all tournaments. Rafa may not be as dominant and he may have to fight harder than Fed to keep his position at the top, but I think he is more than capable of doing so, due to his dominance on clay and also his excellence on grass.

It will be interesting to see how Nole/Murray deal with the challenges of the trio, not to mention Sod and Berdych. If Cilic can build up his physical strength and be more consistent, I see him as a threat to anyone else too. It is interesting to note that Davy can deal with Delpo and Gulbis but he lost to Cilic and Sod more often than not. Murray has the varieties in his game to deal with all these giants. For Nole, his encounters with these giants comes with mixed results, so its hard to see where he is heading going forward.

I'm glad that Delpo is very much on the mend, and will be going back on tour pretty soon.

injimmy,
All this talk about how rubbish Rafa is on h/c, slow or fast or Deco or whatever simply does not stand up to scrutiny. If people take the trouble to look at the facts they will realise that next to Federer and Roddick Rafa has the best record on h/c court in the current tour. Delpo, Sod or Berdych should not be mentioned in the same sentence as Rafa on any surface, Rafa is in the Premier league, to all of them, anywhere, anyday

These are the facts:

Rafa......... W 203 L 66 9 titles - incl 4 Masters 1 GS
Sod......... W 133 L 46 1 title - Indoor (Rotterdam)
Delpo........W 95 L 46 5 titles - incl NO Masters 1 GS
Berdych.....W 128 L 87 1 title - Tokyo

If these guys were so good on h/c, why have they not got a cupboard of trophies?

Juan really, REALLY shouldn't play the USO. In my opinion the risk is huge both mentally and physically. Juan and his team need to wait until there's some certainty he can be copmpetitive. Why throw him to the lions. Hopefully they'll wait until DC where he can play a couple of matches in front of his home fans just to put his head on straight. If he plays the USO I don't think he'd get deep enough to ever play Rafa.

rafa has become really versatile and he is the only top player to stand up2 the big hitters as demonstrated at roland garros against soderling and also at wimby against soderling and berdych. any1 saying murray has the variety to handle da big hitters are wrong cos they always give him beat downs. the only reason nadal was losing to them last yr and early this yr was cos he lost his 'calm' and now that he has regained that he is gonna rule.

Big hitters handing beat downs to Murray?? Why not check up on Delpo's H2H against Murray? Murray has always beaten Delpo on hard courts. Delpo's only victory against Murray was on clay at Madrid 2009. Murray has always beaten Cilic too, on the all surfaces, saved for one exception, at the USO last year.

Murray's H2H with Sod was 2-2. Against Berdych, is 1-2 in Berdych's favor but that recent victory was on clay, Murray's least favored surface.

Please check the ATP website first before commenting about big hitters always giving Murray beat downs! Murray simply has good tactics against these big hitters, though not so much on clay; his game simply frustrates the hell out of them, capitalizing on their not so great movements. Perhaps Fed should take a leaf out of Murray's book and learn how to deal with them, now that he has become a step or two slower, definitely not by trying to out hit them!

Hurray 4 luckystar. Fighting ignorance with plain facts! Thanks mate.

I am always fascinated and more than amazed to see someone like imjimmy think that he knows more than Rafa about what he has to do to win the USO. As though Rafa hasn't already demonstrated a high level of intelligence and awareness about his game and its relative strengths and weaknesses!

I think there are a few things about Rafa's game about which there are serious misconceptions. First, I agree with luckystar's post at 11:59 am. Rafa's ROS is quite underrated. I think Rafa knows that he must stand closer inside the baseline to receive serve. We saw him do exactly that in his fourth round match with Karlovic at this year's AO. He started out in that match staying well behind the baseline, but made the key adjustment during the match to move closer inside the baseline. It paid off handsomely. Rafa was able to get his racket on more of those booming serves that Karlovic can stand there and hit all day.

Rafa demonstrated at Wimbledon that he knows how to turn other opponent's strengths into weaknesses. While Delpo is superior to the likes of Sod and Berdych, he is still not the greatest mover on court. I don't see him rushing his comeback to play at the USO. I think it would be a recipe for disaster. I am sure he is concerned about the points and defending his title, however, it will take time for him to get back to form again. We saw what happened with Rafa as he attempted to come back after his knee injury last year. It is not an easy task. I don't think Delpo would want to risk being embarrassed and suffering a beatdown in the early rounds.

I think that Rafa will be more concerned with Murray/Djoker/Sod/Berdych at the USO. The next time Rafa meets Delpo, I think we will see a very different match. Rafa is not the same player that he was when he played Delpo in the past. He has a much more aggressive game, one in which he is looking to move into the court and hit winners to close out points more quickly. His volleying at net has improved enormously. His serve is much stronger.

I think it's a mistake to read too much into Rafa's last two matches with Delpo. He was just coming back from the knee injury, in his first tournament in Canada when he met Delpo. At the USO, he was badly hampered by the abdominal tear and couldn't serve.

I also wanted to thank nadline for posting the hardcourt results for Rafa. Sometimes just presenting the facts is the best argument.

You are welcome, deuce.

hey luckystar. all the players that beat murray at last yrs slams were big hitters. verdasco, gonzo, roddick who doesnt hav da biggest ground strokes but could be classed a big hitter cos of his serve and cilic. suddenly in slams he doesnt hav da right tactics. im not sayin murray cant beat da big hitters but he gets easily intimidated if they go 4 there shots

Vamosrafa: Excellent post. Especially the part about Nadal's slice backhand. Exactly my thoughts. That's a glaring hole in his game, about not being able to add sufficient underspin when he slices from a defensive position. Rafa should see Fed and Murray hitting the slice. I also agree about your thoughts w.r.t Doha F against Davydenko. The first set was the BEST hardcourt tennis I've EVER seen Rafa play. Unfortunately he didn't do the same in AO, IW or Miami 2010.

luckystar and Nadline: Did you guys read my post properly? When did I say Rafa is rubbish on hardcourts? Or that he would surely lose to the likes of Murray, Djokovic, Fed, Soderling, Davydenko etc? I said he COULD lose, not that he definitely would (BIG difference).

Think about Rafa's game on clay. If Rafa is playing his A game, all these guys would have ZERO chance of beating him. On grass, a slightly better chance, still Rafa would be HEAVILY favored. Now on fast hardcourts, Rafa "could" lose to them even if he's playing well.
Rafa's game on hardcourts is like Fed's game on clay. It's brilliant, but not as good as it is on other surfaces. His results on hardcourts were slow in coming (because of obvious reasons). He made his first hardcourt slam Semifinal in 2008, by which time Fed had already won 13 slams!

I also didn't say that Rafa doesn't know about the changes he has to make to his game to win @ UsOpen. Of course he does! He's probably tactically, one of the smartest player on the tour. In fact Uncle Toni and Rafa were doing exactly that in 2008 and early 2009, before Rafa got injured and then effectively lose a year worth of slams. Now it seems that Rafa can go back to his path of 2008.
However the fact remains that his game does not translate as well on faster hardcourts (for the reasons in the previous post), and it will always be tough for him to change his game at this stage of his career especially when he has 8 slams!

Someone talked about Rafa's return of serve (ROS) being underrated. I agree to an extent. However the stats are misleading. The reason why Rafa has such a high percentage of points won while returning (or high number of breaks of serve) is because of his phenomenal ground game. He just uses the ROS to get into a neutral rally and then dominate from there using his forehand.

If Rafa had a ROS like Murray's (or Fed's) where he had the ability to stand up and attack the ball on the up, he would haven been impossible to beat and perhaps would have had a bunch of hardcourt slams! Rafa is probably the only great player who wins without a first strike weapon (serve, ROS etc) that can get him cheap points. He game is based on using his superior movement and consistent groundies to dominate in neutral rallies. This is neutralized to an extent on fast hardcourts. The reason he wins on grass is because he is MORE aggressive on that surface (see Nadal vs Soderling in Wimb 2010) and stands up while returning serve. This has been true since 2007 on grass. However he hasn't done the same at UsOpen, Cincy or any other fast court tourney where he has trouble adjusting to the comparatively higher bounce and prefers to stay back. And that means he plays more defense and is more vulnerable to big hitters than he is on clay or grass.

Finally luckystar - to my original point about Delpo: I agree Rafa was hampered by an ab injury. But for heaven's sake, he lost 2,2,2! In USOpen 2009, Delpo played some of the MOST brilliant offensive tennis, I've ever seen. Do you honestly think that even a fit Rafa would have beaten that Delpo?

And it's not like Rafa hasn't lost on faster surfaces when he's healthy. I recall he lost in straight sets to Djokovic in Cincy 2008 and Cincy 2009, and he was ok then. Sure Delpo may take a while to get his 2009 when he comes back. But when he does, he would definitely have an edge over Rafa on a fast hardcourt.

I'm happy for DelPotro's return to the USO, however, I wonder if that's a wise move for him to to re-enter the field by playing at a GS, where he has to win 3 of 5 sets. That could place a lot of stress on his injured arm, not to mention the emotional side, whereby he's cognizant that he has 2,000 points to defend. To me, it would have been realistically easier for him physically ad emotionally, if he were to slowly ease himself into competing by playing the smaller tournaments, then the USO. Anyway, only time will tell, but I only hope for his sake he doesn't re-injure his arm.

Nadals obviously going to have the edge over delpo next time he meets(as he will be rusty) On clay and grass,delpo cant win. But if Delpo ever gets back to the form he showed on the north american hard courts lasy year,I would pick him over nadal on any hard court. Why? Because on hard courts,there are NO bad bounces,thus delpo can take nadals topspin on the rise(withouth any bad bounces to wreck his timing) The second reason why Delpo can win is bcoz unlike other big forehands(soderlign,tsonga,gonzo etc),delpo can do as much damage with his forehand cross court as he can inside out/in. We have countless players with big forehands that can do damage inside out,but arent as effective cross court.(which is why I consider his forehand to the most effective outside of fed n nadal) The next reason why he can win is that he has the ability to hit winners while he is ON THE RUN. That is something which soderling and berdych cant do well,bcoz they arent good defenders. This is the reason why Del Potro could beat Federer at last years US Open(when federer was near his best) and Soderling failed miserably at the task. Finally,Delpo is a better thinker on court than other hitters. Most big hitters hit every ball as hard as they can(eg Soderling) But anyone who has watched Delpo play knows that he works the ball around,and decides to pull the trigger at the right moment. Also,he is FAR MORE mentally tough than other hitters like soderling,tsonga,berdych etc. This is assuming both men are at their best.

luckystar-you are right. I forgot about cilic! His groundstrokes are so smooth-it reminds me a lot of Federer in his prime. But he has a short fuse mentality(aka going for winners too much) and too often,he makes unnecessary unforced errors. If he can control that,he can become a multiple slam champion. Even though his results havent been that great,I can see a diamond in the rough the way I could with federer(b4 he made his breakthrough) However,I think whilst Cilic has a bit more variety than Delpo,I think DP is a better ball striker. DP doesnt even swing hard at the ball-it just explodes off his racquet. That is purity of ball striking at its best,and it reminds me off agassi. I think they are just as talented as each other. However,I think Gulbis has more potential and talent than either CIlic and Delpotro. Why? Because he is almost as powerful as they are,but is a far better mover,and has better touch.(his drop shot is one of the best in the game) Furthermore, if you look over tennis history,no one over 6'3" has ever dominated. ANd there is a reason for it. Taller players physically break down easier-as there is more bending and flexing to do,and that is absolutely brutal if you do it day in day out. It also means that you are a lot more injury prone. So I think Cilic and Del Potro can win 3-4 slams. BUt no more. Gulbis has potential to win a a few more than Cilic and Del Potro,and can be number for a while if u ask me. This is all potential of course,doesnt mean it will happen.

Again many are forgetting about the intangibles in any future matchup between Rafa and Delpo. We saw what Rafa is like when he is mentally tough and supremely confident. He simply refuses to lose. He can out think and out maneuver just about anyone. Rafa's movement is also another "x" factor that many fail to take into account.


I think if Rafa can keep up the kind of form he has shown, combined with his formidable mental ferocity, then neither Delpo or anyone else will be able to defeat him. I know that Delpo is the great hope of many who dearly wish to see someone challenge Rafa and not let him dominate the game. It remains to be seen how long it will take him to get back into form and how he will adjust post-surgery.

I am not and have never been, a fan of Gulbis. If ever there was a player who is so overrated by some, he is the one. Of course he is quite talented and naturally gifted. If that was all it takes to be a champion, then he should have won several grand slams by now. Unfortunately for him, it takes much more to be a great player. Gulbis has made some strides in the right direction thanks to his coach. If he can develop a real work ethic and show a willingness to committ to the long hours of practice required to be physically fit enough to compete and win consistently, then he has a chance to move up in the ranks. Right now, for me he is a huge question mark. I have seen too many highly talented players come along over the decades and flash brightly for a very short time, only to sink into obscurity for good.

imjimmy, you are the one who didn't read my post properly. First, I am not the one who says you thought Rafa was rubbish on hard courts. Second, I didn't say that Rafa would have beaten Delpo at last year's USO if Rafa didn't have the abdominal muscle tear. What I mentioned was Delpo would have to go the distance to beat Rafa!

You mentioned that Rafa was not injured during some of those defeats he suffered at the US fast hard courts. Of course that is true because 1) during those years prior to 2008, his hard court game wasn't good enough, at least on fast hard courts; 2) Rafa always run out of steam during the second half of the season as he overplayed during the clay court season, he almost always played 5 clay tournaments every year and winning most of them (2006 and 2010 being the exceptions); 3) the overplaying had led to his knee tendinitis problems, remember his problem during USO 2007, where he lost to Ferrer? At one point during the match, he fell down and really had difficulty getting up; 4) in 2008, his hard court game had improved so much that he really had a good chance at the USO, but he had given priority to the Olympics and hence arrived at the USO running out of gas. I'm one of those that feel that had it not for the Olympics, Rafa would have beaten Murray, and then Fed in the final. No doubt Rafa was beaten by Nole at Cincy, however, Rafa did turn the table against Nole at the Olympics where he had beaten Nole in three sets at the semifinal.

I believe when all of them are in top forms, players like Nole/Murray/Delpo will always give Rafa troubles on fast hard courts. However that does not mean that Rafa has zero chance of beating them. It will be something like they have to go the distance to beat a top form Rafa, and Rafa will have to go the distance to beat them too. Moreover, Rafa is fast improving his game, and after his injury last year, he has learned to play more aggressively and relying more on his strategies rather than his speed and power to do the job.

Rafa has also improved on his serves and his ROS. His serving was impressive at this year's Wimbledon, esp in the final. He, like Fed now, has learned to work on his second serves. We see Berdych and Murray having problems returning Rafa's second serves. He really jammed Berdych at the baseline with his second serves and he sometimes gave Berdych no pace to work on with his second serves. Rafa really served very intelligently during that match. I'm also impressed by how well Rafa returned Berdych's serves too. Overall, I see lots of improvement in Rafa's game and I hope he can bring all these improvements to his hard court game. We'll have to wait and see how well he can adapt his game to the fast hard courts.

luckystar,

I believe that imjimmy's comments should have been directed at me. I was the one who said that Rafa's abdominal tear was the cause for his lopsided loss to Delpo in the semis of last year's USO. I don't know for a certainty that Rafa would have beaten him if he were not injured, but I do know that it would have been a much more competitive match. Even without the abdominal tear, Rafa was nowhere near his best form.

I decided to watch some of Rafa's matches at last year's USO some months ago. I wanted to have a point of reference to how he was playing this year. Even at this year's AO, we saw Rafa playing much better than he had in the closing months of 2009. I realized how far he had come when I decided to replay some of Rafa's matches from last year's USO. Rafa was not moving nearly as well at that time. He wasn't playing aggressive tennis and didn't have his confidence.

Rafa was nowhere near his best even without the abdominal injury and Delpo was in scintillating form. He was hitting the ball so well and on top of his game. I don't think anyone would have beaten him.

It was nadline who accused imjimmy of saying that Rafa was rubbish on hard court. She posted Rafa's win/loss record, comparing him to his rivals.

I happen to agree with you about Rafa losing out on a chance to win the USO in 2008 by deciding to participate in the Olympics. Watching Rafa's matches at the 2008 USO, I could see that he was running on fumes and was exhausted both mentally and physically. I am sure that Rafa feels it was worth it to get the gold medal. I am hoping that for once, Rafa can arrive at the USO in great shape physically and mentally. He hasn't played himself into the ground, the knees are receiving this new treatment and his mental toughness and confidence couldn't be higher. He is feeling it, as I like to say!

I also agree that players like Nole/Murray/Djoker and Delpo will always give Rafa a challenge on hard courts. If Rafa is in form and mentally on, then I think he will have the advantage. I also believe that the changes he has made to his game will help him be more competitive and win more efficiently and more often.

tj: this is genuine question not smart alec one! But if Delboy is such a "clean" striker of the ball how come, at such a young age, has he received this horrible injury?
luckystar: Rafa's second serve also very underestimated, Andy said how difficult it is to return and as he is one of the best returners in the game, we should listen.

Is Delpo beatable on fast hard courts? Of course he is beatable. Davy did beat Delpo comfortably by not allowing Delpo to out hit him. Davy worked the angles, rushed Delpo at the net, moved the big man around and didn't try to over power him. Davy is also one player who takes the ball early, rushing his opponents time after time with his quick returns. No wonder Delpo said that Davy played like play station. Davy also has a 2-0 H2H advantage over Delpo, really impressive for a small guy like Davy. Fed when in top form also can outplay Delpo but now that he is a step or two slower, he can't do that anymore. Murray somehow also knows how to deal with Delpo, frustrating Delpo into making errors, though Murray has to be careful not to be blown off the court by Delpo.

I think Rafa can deal with Delpo, though definitely not dominating him on the fast hard courts. I don't think Delpo will always beat Rafa there. Too much had been said about Rafa's top spin on hard courts; do notice that Rafa can flatten his fore hand too and with his new strings, he would not give Delpo or others many short balls to work on. Rafa has also adjusted his position at the baseline by standing nearer to it. I remember Delpo mentioned after his USO win over Rafa that he saw Rafa standing so far behind the baseline that Delpo had decided to come in to the net to finish the points. Rafa back then could not rely on his down the line forehand and always went cross court so much so that it became predictable and Delpo returned them with interest.

Rafa being the master strategist, should be able to adapt his game to deal with the likes of Delpo. Who knows, he may have studied how Davy/Murray played against Delpo and get some inspiration from there.

ijusth8u - Verdasco beating Murray at the AO last year was an exception more than the norm. Do you know Murray has beaten Verdasco every time they met, saved for that AO encounter? Verdasco was on red hot form that AO, he had also beaten Tsonga en route to his first semifinal in a slam, and he gave Rafa so much problems at that semifinal and Rafa had to spend more than five hours on the court to finally defeat Verdasco.

Against Gonzo, it was on clay, Murray's least favored surface. Still Murray was beaten in four sets, not in straight sets. Against Roddick at Wimbledon, he wasn't being blown away by Roddick; that tie-break in the fourth set was close. Roddick did go on to give Fed a run for his money in the final, and Fed had to really go the distance, serving 50 over aces to beat a red hot Roddick. Against Cilic at the USO last year, Murray did have a bad wrist, if not how would Cilic beat Murray in straight sets, when all along, Murray had beaten Cilic every time they met. Cilic had also tested Delpo in the next round and Delpo had to beat Cilic in four sets.

So, contrary to what you believe, Murray has the game to deal with the big hitters. The only thing is, he has to be in top form or at least in reasonably good form to execute his game plan to perfection to beat them, and avoiding being out hit or over powered by them. Murray will have problems with them when he is not playing his best level, but others would also have problems with these big hitters too, saved for a few top players.

Murray's problem is with both Fed and Rafa. These two guys simply have the game, the experience, the skill and the stamina to outdo Murray, unless they are not at their best form. I'm interested to see how a top form Murray fare against a top form Nole. Its being a long time, since Miami 2009, that the two had met. Now that Nole is no.2, maybe they can meet more often now? Other than Fed, Rafa & Davy, I like both Nole and Murray's games when they are on. Not forgetting Cilic too.

luckystar: those my favourites too also a couple of others that are coming up but I haven't seen too much of, Istomin, Dolgopwtatever, de Bakker, Gulbis when he's on! So many to like! Regarding Andy, I could make a list of completely different players, like Ferrer, Stephanek who've beaten him and then make a completely arguement. You could do that for any of them, I guess.

luckystar: I guess we don't disagree. (Which is good!) My point was just that it is unreasonable to expect the same level of performance from Nadal on hardcourts as on grass and clay. His athleticism, movement, quick reflexes and ability to deal with variable bounce translates very well to grass. Rafa was phenomenal on grass as early as 2007 even when he was a much lesser player on hardcourts.

On grass Rafa's spinny serve takes a life of their own. It's extremely hard to attack even his 2nd serves consistently. The forehand too is devastating as the grass takes the spin well and still allows sufficient penetration. None of this happens on hardcourts, where players tee of his 2nd serve and his forehand lacks penetration and sits up to be hit. In fact his backhand is a better weapon there. Plus he loses the edge in movement on hardcourts that he has on grass.

Also I think you're underestimating Delpo. He was just 20 and still nowhere close to his peak. His serve had a decent room for improvement (10-15% as his toss is still low), and his movement would surely have gotten better still. TJ600 up thread has an excellent post on Delpo. Suffice to say that Delpo has the big hitting offensive tennis as someone like a Soderling. What he does have that Soderling doesn't is the mental chops to hang with Rafa along with the ability to hit on the run (where Soderling got exposed big time in Wimb 2010). That to me indicates that a healthy Delpo would have a edge over Rafa on hardcourts and Rafa in turn would obviously be favored on grass and clay.

I guess all this talk is moot until we see Delpo back in action. It might take him sometime to get back to his past form. Let's hope for the best.

Coming to the UsOpen, I think the hardest rivals for Nadal would be: Murray, Federer, Djokovic, Soderling - roughly in that order.

Match up wise, I think Djokovic is the toughest for Rafa on hard courts. Their h2h is 7-3 on harcourts which include plenty of lopsided straight set victories for Novak. The main issue for Djokovic is whether he can translate his domination of Rafa on hard courts to the big matches in slams. So it is more of a mental issue rather than actual game. When the stakes ARE at their highest, Rafa beat Novak at the Olympics. But if Novak comes in believing in his chances, and plays Rafa the way he plays him in masters series (Cincy for ex) , I think he'd be a decent favorite against Rafa. All that said, I don't think Djokovic is mentally the player he was in 2007/2008. So I am putting him lower in the list as a potential threat to Nadal.

Murray is more of a puzzle. With respect to his slam performances, I really do think that he won't win one until he gets MORE aggressive with his forehand and second serve. Interestingly he is the ONLY player to have beaten Nadal in two different slams! That's a very telling fact. All of the Nadal-Murray matches have been VERY close, even the ones won in straight sets by either player (except the windy crazy IW 2009 match). Murray for some reason always plays aggressively against Nadal. By his own admission, he gets out of his element when playing Nadal and is generally able to execute.

Curiously, I thought Murray was EVEN better in Wimb 2010 SF than he was in AO 2010 QF. Unfortunately for him, the SW19 match was a virtuoso performance from Rafa. I recall Murray served 75% in both sets 1 and 2. He lost something like 4 points on serve in the 2nd set. YET Rafa won both sets, and handed Murray a straight sets defeat. This just goes to show how well Rafa plays on grass. If Murray plays as well in the UsOpen, I suspect he has a decent chance of beating Nadal.

Lastly, I don't see Fed being discussed a lot. I know his form has been patchy. But let's keep in mind, his phenomenal record in NY, where he's lost just ONCE in six years. As I've said numerous times before, I think Fed's game is BETTER on deco-turf (of UsOpen) than it is even on grass. His forehand penetrates much more in Flushing and his net play, movement is super sharp. I really don't see anyone other than a well playing Rafa upsetting Fed in the UsOpen. That's assuming Fed plays decently in the warm up tournaments and peaks in the USOpen as he did in 2008.

I won't be surprised in the least if Fed wins UsOpen (especially if Rafa were to lose early). That said, I would REALLY love to see Fed-Rafa face off in NYC. Not least because I will be there :)

imjimmy, I did not underestimate Delpo. I recognize that he will be one hell of a player to beat on a fast hard court. However that does not mean that he is unbeatable, as Davy and Murray have shown us.

Can Rafa beat Delpo on a fast hard court? Yes, if he adopts the right strategy. Of course Rafa's top spin wouldn't work as well on the hard courts, we all know that since long time ago, when the likes of Berdych/Youzhny/ Gonzo were giving Rafa all sorts of problems. We see now Rafa has learned how to deal with them. Can Rafa learn how to deal with the new batch of big hitters, and Delpo in particular? Yes of course! Rafa is not the no.1 player now for nothing. Beating Delpo requires a lot of strategic thinking, if not how would you expect a tiny Davy to beat him? And how would you expect a Murray, who is not known to be a power hitter, to beat Delpo time and again?

Rafa can hit flatten out forehands too. This is something he had been doing since he started out on the tours. If you watched his matches against Hewitt at the AO 2004 & 2005, you would notice that he hits his forehand much flatter than he is hitting now. It seems that after having success against Fed, esp on clay with his topspin forehand, Rafa continued to hit his forehand with lots of topspin. It was until the AO 2009, that he begun to flatten his forehand once again and we saw how successful he was by winning the AO title for the first time. Of course, his flat cross court backhand played an important part too in helping him winning that AO title. I'm sure Rafa is intelligent enough as a player to learn from his own mistakes and also learn from others on how they deal with problematic players.

Delpo is 21 now and going to be 22 come September, not a 20 years old anymore. Its sad that his progress was stalled by his wrist injury, just like Rafa was stalled by his knee injury. He may need three to six months to get back on track, and I'm not sure how well his wrist would hold up and would he be able to hit his awesome forehand again, like he did before this injury? I wish him well, and like I mentioned before, Delpo is a bit like Rafa, mentally tough, he is one champion material and it would be sad if he can't fulfill his potential as a great player.

A lot of people beat Rafa last year. Soderling, Delpo, at one point the list seemed endless. But that was then, this is now. As early as IW and Miami, I knew the Rafa of 2010 would more than make up for the unpleasant memories of 2009. I think he's ready for HC this season. He's peaking at a perfect time, coming off two GS victories and he's resting those knees. Rafa's going to prove a lot of people wrong this hard court season.

As for Rafa v Delpo, very premature talk. I certainly wouldn't arrive at any conclusions based on last year's performances by both men because Delpo was on a hot streak and Rafa was seriously underperforming. In my mind, there's no question mark over Rafa, the question mark is over Delpo's head. Not just questions about his recovery from this terrible, terrible injury but whether he would have been able to maintain that hot streak for any stretch of time to prove it wasn't a one-off. Djokovic won a slam too remember, and everyone thought he was the next big thing. He's still near top but where are all his subsequent GS finals? Who's to say Delpo wouldn't have turned out the same way?

We'll never know now, of course and all one can do is wish him the very best in his recovery. I hope he heals properly and completely. After that, he's got a lot to prove in my opinion.

@deuce
agassi,davydenko and nalbandian are clean hitters. but they have wrist injuries in their careers.

Agree with you Zooni.

deuce - among this new batch of 21-23,24 years old, namely De Bakker, Dolgopolov, Haase, Bozo, Giraldo, Istomin, Nishikori, I like De Bakker the most. He is a Wimbledon junior champion ( I forget which year it was). He has game and he can serve well and can play at the net too. He can play on grass and on clay. I think his game suits the hard courts too.

At this year's Wimbledon, we see many interesting young players (in the above mentioned age group). This Dolgo guy is very interesting, his serve and his game in general is very difficult to read. I remember his match against Rafa at Madrid this year, though Rafa had beaten him in straight sets, Rafa did mention that Dolgo's style of play was rather unique and hard to read. Dolgo gave Tsonga so much problem at Wimbledon this year and Tsonga had to beat Dolgo in five sets, and something like 10-8 in the final set! All these up and coming players seem to have one thing in common, ie big serves. What they lack is experience esp at the big stage. This Giraldo guy also can hit very good ground strokes too, and Bozo's game is also very special, he can hit with one or two handed forehand and his serve is awesome. I like Haase too, and hell, even Petzschner's game on grass. Like what you said, deuce, there are so many players to like, just hope that they play up to their full potential, but please, please, don't ever beat dear Rafa, for I want to see Rafa end up as year end no.1, and for a few more years and achieved greatness in his own right. Thereafter the likes of Nole/Murray/Delpo, even Cilic can challenge for the top spot.

It will be interesting to see these up and coming players playing against each other, like Haase vs Petz; Bozo vs Dolgo; De Bakker vs Istomin; Giraldo vs Nishikori (De Bakker did beat Giraldo at Wimbledon this year, I think in four or five sets). I would also like to see Gulbis vs these guys too.

Gulbis does have the game and the talent to be a top player, but it seems he can get injured easily despite not playing full schedules which the top players have to do. He seems to lack the determination too to tough it out at the practice courts day in day out. I don't expect much out of him, maybe like what he himself put it, his aim is to win one slam, just to prove that he can do it, and then he'll quit tennis and enjoy his life elsewhere.

deuce - "Dolgopwtatever ..." LOL!

imjimmy - gee, why are you so clever?

On the point in case - i.e. delpo - I don't think anyone serious expects him to be able to defend his points at FM so soon after such a long lay-off. Every so often, someone hits a purply patch - e.g. cilic at the turn of the year, verdasco a year or so ago, soderling more recently, and kolya and (in times past) nalby from time to time. I think delpo has the class and aura about him to do more than any of these guys and stay up near the very top for a long time, although only time will tell as he is still young. If he does return to his 2009 USO form by the end of the h'c season, the scary thing for some of the other top guys is that he has no points to defend in the first half of 2011 and could conceivably, at the start of USO 2012, be aiming for the world no. 1 spot. That, of course, is a very long way off and we'll have to wait and see how well he recovers and resumes his on-court development. One thing's for sure, you don't win the USO without having it mentally.

imjimmy - ps. i do seriously commend your knowledge and am only taking the micky a little bit :)

Actually Delpo needs some match plays to get back to his old form, just like what Rafa did. I don't see him becoming a threat so soon at the AO next year. If he can't defend his USO title this year, he'll be left with one thousand over ranking points after the USO. Not forgetting, he won't be able to defend his WTF finals 800 ranking points either, as he won't qualify for the WTF this year. If he can come back during the Asian hard court swing and also the indoor hard court swing, then maybe he'll gain some points.

We assume that Delpo will come back and starts to beat up everyone on the hard courts, but that really remains as assumptions only. We see last year he won at Washington, reached the final at Montreal and lost to Murray, running out of steam during that final and had to miss Cincy. In my opinion, he was fortunate to run into a not so fit Rafa and able to beat Rafa in straight sets. If he was held up by Rafa and had to go the distance to beat Rafa, I think Fed would end up winning the USO for the sixth straight year.

alex - Delpo becoming no.1 by 2012 USO I think while there is a possibility, there is only a slim chance. You are assuming that he'll dominate over everyone on the hard court, which I think is highly unlikely. He has to contend with Nole/Murray/Rafa/Cilic/Berdych/Sod/Fed and Davy. You think he can dominate over all of them?? And don't tell me until now you are still thinking of him dominating over Rafa on clay too?? I believe he would have difficulty beating Nole/Verdasco/Gonzo/Sod/Berdych and clay court experts like Ferrer, Almagro too. If Delpo can't dominate on any surface, how then can he become no.1? Don't forget Fed was able to dominate for so long because he practically dominates over everyone, except Rafa, on hard courts and on grass, and he was the second best on clay. Rafa can dominate over everyone on clay, and almost everyone on grass. He is also very good on hard courts and can win some important tournaments on hard courts too.

In my opinion, Delpo will be a legitimate contender for the no.1 spot, together with Nole and Murray, but that will be only after Rafa is on the decline and Fed is out of the picture too, that means maybe another three years more at least. Rafa is reaching his prime now and he'll most likely stay there for two to three years, unless his body breaks down again (highly unlikely now as he is so smart in his planning now and plays a physically more economical and more strategic game). As long as Rafa has a strong hold on clay and grass and does reasonably well on hard courts, he'll most likely stay ahead of the pack. That's my take, well not everyone has to agree of course, only time will tell and I guess we have to be patient, wait and see what will happen.

I mentioned on another thread that DelPotro's return to the USO might not be such a good idea due to the USO being a GS and he'd have to play at least 3 sets to win a match. I think it would have been wiser for him to try to play at one of the smaller tournaments as a gauge to see how his arm would respond, instead of going into the USO witout any prior match play.

Also, I hope he doesn't re-injure his arm by hitting his FH so hard as he has done previously. Let us not forget that it's the manner in which he whacked his FH that caused the injury in the first place, and if he begins to hit that way again, there is a strong possibility he could end up with the same problem which will not be easy to recover from a second time. He stated he likes to play on HC, using his serve and FH to end points quickly because he does not like to run. It seems that he's dependent mainly on those two weapons and I'm wondering psychologically how it will affect his game knowing in the recesses of his mind that he has to use extreme caution so as not to re-injure his arm a second time. That has to be a serious hindrance for him. As a result of that situation, which could become a psychological one, I hope that he has a new game strategy when he returns to playing again, in order to avoid over-use of his FH and possibly reinjury. I we'll know when he plays at the USO what changes he's made to his game.

hi lucky - you're probably right (altho my suggestion was by the END of USO 2011, not before it). As a muzz fan, I hope his raw power doesn't beat muzz's craft and variety (altho delpo has some nice tocu around the net too). As far as rafa's concerned he'd have dismissed delpo like he did everyone else at wimbie. I don't go as far as some saying rafa can't do it on H/C - he's already DONE it in Oz and - scary - he is still pretty young and improving on h'c, as the general trend of his masters' performances have shown.

All I am saying is that if someone told me that a well-fit and on-form delpo was to find himself at the beginning of USO 2011 with the possibility of a tournament win putting him to #1 I would not be shocked.

Personally, I'd rather it were muzz, and next to that rafa (who it will probably be).

I find it hard to believe he can come back after an extended break without match practice and survive the riguours of a Slam for long. At the best of times he often becomes fatigued quickly and I would expect a couple of hard fought 4 or 5 set matches will put paid to his chances of going deep into the USO this year.

I think that whilst conventional wisdom would suggest Delpo isnt a threat at next yrs AO,I think its possible he can make a deep run there. Why? Lets wind back to 2004. Marat Safin was coming off a injury plagued year(how ironic that he was plagued by a wrist injury as well),and his ranking had pummeled to 86. However,he still made it to the AO final,and he beat agassi and roddick in 5 sets,(those guys were at the top of the rankings) and played a host of other tough matches,taking his total match time up until the finals to 18hr50mins. And it took an in prime roger federer,to beat him. If he wasnt tired,I think he could have had a shot at winning,as at that point in time,he was capable of going shot for shot with Federer on a hard court.(in the next yr when he was frest,he outlasted federer in a 5 set epic.) So it is definitely possible that Del Potro can make a comeback with a bang,

@Von
im not so sure that DPs wrist injury is due to him hitting the ball hard. Davydenko,Agassi,Nalbandian and Safin have all had wrist injuries,and they dont/didnt hit the ball as hard as del potro did.(with the possible exception of Safin)

I think people have forgot that Delpo has reached French Semis in 2009.He was 2 sets to 1 against Fed..

So I think Delpo can still beat few good claycourt specialist (If delpo is 100% and plays the game with good tactics).

He is good on Hard court but what I belive is he is very good at American hardcourt events as compare to other hc events.And nadal can beat him in those non american HC tournament.(You can check his last years max points came from American HC events)..

He can stay in top 10 by the end of next year(Even in top 5) but asking him to be the year end no 1 is simply too much.

Delpo did reach the semi of RG & Madrid last year and was stopped by Fed both times. He was also stopped by Nole in the QF at Rome last year. While I think Delpo can play reasonably well on clay, I see others like Gonzo, Verdasco, Almagro, Sod and Berdych giving him a good fight on clay.

Sod had reached two RG finals, beating Fed and Rafa. He had also beaten Davy, Ferrer, Gonzo en route to his RG final last year. So, Sod vs Delpo on clay, there is no guarantee that Delpo will win. We also see Berdych reaching RG semi and Almagro reaching RG QF(he was stopped by Rafa at QF) this year, so they can play on clay. Verdasco and Gonzo also have respectable results on clay, Verdasco reached his masters final on clay this year and won Barcelona; Gonzo has reached semi of RG last year and final at Rome in 07. All these players are good on clay and so who is to say that Delpo will always beat them? The only thing I can say is Rafa will always beat them on clay!

alex: take heart, Andy is 5-1 on Delboy.

luckystar,

There cant be any debate about clayspecialist beating Nadal(He is simply too good for everyone).

About Delpo even he is improving (How we see Nadal evolving from Clayking to be the winner at Wimby and at AO) so there are still good hopes for Delpo to improve.If Delpo stay focused to improve most of his games aspect(You cant simply win by hitting winners, right?)..He is good enough to finish 2011 in Top10(If fit)..

deuce,

Even if Andy is 5-1 , delpo has enough time in his career to turn the stats around..
If the match is played at American HC I will go for Delpo, if it is AO then it will be Murray.

In Wimby Murray will have the edge due to massive crowd support and on clay Delpo can hit his shorts but Murray has good defence to takkle him..2011 will be more interesting..

makes me smile, deuce, makes me smile :-)

lucky - now you make it sound like I'm predicting delpo will be #1 after USO 2011. I'm not predicting/assuming that either, just saying it wouldn't shock me if it were to happen. Since you push me to it, here is my bet for the top 5 after USO 2011:
1) rafa (by a distance), 2) muzz, 3) delpo, 4) fed, 5) djoker.

i think that towards the ending of 2012, del potro has an excellent shot of being number one. He will be 24,and would have fully matured by then,and will be at the height of his powers. Federer will be in his thirties,and nadal will be 26,and due to the physical nature of his game,I think he will start to come out of his prime. Murray,Djokovic and Gulbis should be the other contenders for the top spot.

My God, I cant believe you people are already talking about Del Potro being number 1 by 2012, are you nuts, let the guy play a match first.

For all anybody knows his wrist injury could pose him problems...its not a knee its his wrist, which takes the full brunt of every ball he hits or returns. You can run on sore knees, a screwed wrist means you cant hit the ball and if you can with much less power and in great duress...forget about serving, not forgetting thatthe most pain comes when trying to return a heavy ball, because it is your wrist which soaks up the power.

Please...let the guy recover and see how he goes.

Its clear most people on here no nothing about tennis, nor have they probably played any competitive sport in their life, because if you know the body, you know that these comments are ridiculous!
If someone asked me would you want a screwed knee or a screwed wrist, I would take the knee without question! You can shorten the points, to save the knees and move your opponent around but with the wrist there is nothing you can do, as tennis is about hitting a ball with a racket in your hand.

For anyone thinking Delpo is just going to hit the track full speed winning tournaments left and right, why don't you take a look at what Davy has done since returning to the tour. It's going to take Juan a full year just to get his feet back on the ground.

tj600: I think Delpotro's injury was a combination of strings and his hitting the ball very hard. It was clear at times when he hit the ball with his FH how much of an effort it took as he grunted very loudly. When Safin sustained the injury to his wrist he mentioned the strings played a huge part in his injury.

Think for a moment how much pressure those strings place on the arm of the player. When the ball makes contact with the racquet it prduces a kind of reverberation throughout the whole arm and that is what causes the nerve damage. It's an over-use injury. Much has been written on the new strings by experts, that while giving the player an edge, it also causes injuries. DelPotro's arms are not the most muscular arms around, and it's not difficult to understand how much the strings condoned to his injury. Safin always hit the ball hard, but whn he changed strings that's when his injury occurred.

As I mentioned previously, DelPotro wll NOT be able to hit the ground running when he returns. He'll have to take things very carefully and not make the mistake of succumbing to over-use of the arm/wrist. And, it will affect him psychologically. He'll probably become very frustrated as he'll have to play with the wrist in mind by making allowances and chages in his hitting MO.

I agree with those who say that it will probably take a full year for DelPotro to return to 100 percent, but I speak from experience as one who's sustained his type of injury. If he recovers 80 percent of his previous form, he should give thanks to the Almighty. Davy didn't have surgery and he still struggles. Murray, also didn't have surgery and he re-injured his wrist. Sharapova sustained a rotator cuff tear and had to change her serve delivery, not to mention the numerable double faults she commits in each match.

The foregoing is just an example of the problems encountered by those three players, one had surgery and two didn't. Thus, what do you think will be DelPotro's scenario? Anyway, faous last words, only tim will tell ....

isabeau77, 7/20/10 3:00 AM ,

You're back! I have missed reading your great posts. My favorite psychic and sage when it comes to all things tennis.

Thanks for providing a welcome dose of reality among this premature discussion about Delpo being #1, winning more grand slams, etc. Some here seem to be in a state of denial as to the seriousness of his wrist injury. He's not going to just bounce right back and start blasting those forehands as though he never stopped!

Even if one hasn't sustained this kind of injury, it doesn't take a lot of common sense and realism to know that this will be a long road back. Even Delpo won't know how it feels until he actually starts hitting a racket again. There are no guarantees in this situation. He found a world renowned surgeon, the best in his field and put his hopes on the line. I think everyone wants to see him back playing tennis again. However, the road will be fraught with peril.

That's why I just do not see Delpo showing up for the USO. He needs a lot of time to strengthen the muscles in his arm and build up his wrist. The last thing he needs is to rush things and risk reinjury. He may have to adjust and retool his game to accomodate the limits of what his wrist can now do. We just don't know.

I agree with you, isabeau, that it is infinitely preferable to have knee problems than this type of severe wrist injury. You make some excellent points about how a player can manage to compensate for knee injuries, but a bad wrist affects every single shot, every time you hit the ball.

I have never been one to anoint a player with something that he has not yet earned. I wish Delpo well in his journey to recovery. I do think that the estimate of up to a year to fully recover may not be that far off. I would love to see him go out and fulfull his destiny. Even without the injury, I think many are bit too quick to dismiss Murray, Djoker, Fed and the up and comers like Sod, Berdych and Cilic. I think these talented players may well have a say as to who assumes the mantle after Fed and Rafa.

For now, I am just going to enjoy this time of renaissance! I am still over the moon about Rafa's great repeat of the channel slam. I cannot wait until the USO starts! I think Rafa is just feeling it right now and will be a formidable force there this year!

All this discussion about JMDP as a future No.1 puzzles me. I see nothing in his form to date which suggests he will overtake the current field AND remain there! His main claim to fame rests on the GS win against Federer, followed by the win at the WTF in London.

True he has beaten most of his other main rivals at some point: but the three wins against Rafa were all in 2009 (when Rafa was far from his best); he has never beaten Djokovic; his H2H against Murray stands at 1:5; against Davydenko 1:4 (the sole win was in Davis Cup); the only player he has 'owned' is Roddick in all three of their encounters.

I can't help but remember his dismal (bordering on disgraceful) QF match with Federer at the '10 AO which should have earned him a hefty fine for lack of effort. Hardly the stuff of a future world champion. And he has yet to win a Masters' title!

There are certain similarities with Safin. Bags of talent and flashes of brilliance combined with formidable power. Unbeatable on a good day but lacking the consistency to remain in the upper echelons of tennis.

Yes ed, I agree on most of the points that you mentioned. Its too early to pronounce Delpo as a future no.1, in fact a bit insulting to the rest of the field, in particular Nole and Murray. Nole and Murray have proven that they are here to stay by being consistently, at least for two years running now, in the top four spots. To dismiss them and jump ahead and anoint Delpo as the future no.1 may be something to far fetch, esp now that Delpo has suffered a serious wrist injury.

Personally, after the Fedal era, I like both Nole and Murray's chances to hold the top two spots, taking turns to be no.1. As I've mentioned, I think Rafa may be able to hold on to the top spot for another two/three years, by then Nole and Murray should be matured enough (both in terms of their game and in terms of their mentality) to take over from Rafa. Rafa and Fed by then may have cut down on their schedules and choose to play wherever they like.

Well, the two young giants (Delpo & Cilic) may pose challenges to Nole/Murray in future but I think Nole & Murray should have enough games to deal with them, at least for a while. By then Sod and Berdych will be around 28/29 years old, I don't think they can really threaten the top two positions.

Of course, by then there may be some young guns who may arise and challenge the order. Could it be Tomic/Harrison/Dimitrov? Oh may be one of my young favorite now, De Bakker? And the highly unlikely Gulbis?

Del Potro is good, but not really close to Safin in terms of talent.

luckystar: All the names you mention will probably be in the top 10 for some years to come but I have a hunch the next bunch to dominate the tour for the same length of time as Federer & Co. has not yet shown up on the radar.

luckystar and ed,

Agree with both nadal has good chances to be number 1 for next 2 to 3 years(Only clay court session can help him get around 5000 points and he can dominate clay if 100% fit) and would need to do well to stay at top.

On the otherhand other players will battle out for other events.

Murray and Djoker are consistent from last 2 to 3 years.they can do well in near future but they will have to be positive about the chances they will get to be #1.(Because sometimes you start loosing your temprament after doing so well you fail to be #1).
Initially this year or last year Djoker's coach said that he is not satisfied at being #3 or #4.Lets see if they stay optimistic about their chances they can reach at top at some point.

New players who are 18 to 20 and are performing well will have good chances to be in top 10 after 4 to 5 years(When nadal might not be as dominant as he is and Fed would have over by that time).

Delpo have one of the most powerfull forehand but to be #1 that is definetily not enough as he needs to improve, as I have told above that We had seen nadal improving even delpo has can improve because he has age at his side..But this will depend on how he comes back and plan his future tournaments..

Maybe some will laugh, but I think Querrey and Isner will be in the top 5 at some point. If iIner improves on his ground game, and stays healthy he can give Murray and Djokovic some headaches. Sam is good, with his serve and FH, but Sam is a bit mentally weak. He needs to become more focused, not get too down on himself, and not over-schedule.

Isner showed a lot of mental toughness in that match vs. Mahut. I think for someone who's hd to deal with mono just six months ago, John is doing pretty well. Hopefully, he'll be free of any residual side-effects from the mono and can focus on playing.

ed251137, 7/20/10 11:01 AM,

I enjoyed reading your thoughts on Delpo. It was also interesting to see his H2H record against some of the top players. For some time I have felt that there were people who jumped on the Delpo bandwagon after his win over Fed at last year's USO. He did nothing after that until the WTF, where he lost to Davy in the final. Then he came into the 2010 AO obviously struggling with yet another injury, although this time a much more serious one. One slam wonders pop up very often. It remains to be seen if Delpo can once more find the form he was in last year and if his wrist heals well enough for him to be able to play the same kind of tennis.

I just wanted to point out one thing that confused me. Didn't you mean the 2009 AO, where Delpo was embarrassed and utterly humiliated by Fed in the quarterfinals? I think he was bagelled in more than one set. It was a real low point for him.

NNY: yes, of course I meant 09' - a slip-up while I was editing the comment. And you're right - having lost the first set, he just threw in the towel and was bagelled in the next two sets.

I don't think Delpo or Nole will be one slam wonders, neither will I see Murray as a slamless player when their respective tennis careers are over. They are simply too good for that to happen. Do know that these three guys were stopped at the slams by either Fed or Rafa time and again. Without Fed and Rafa, they might have won a few slams by now.

Fed and Rafa won't be around forever, these three guys will outlast the two, or at least outlast the two's peak days. Unless we are seeing some promising young guns in the horizon who could rise and challenge them, I see those three will dominate the tennis scene and win more slams once the Fed/Rafa era is over.

@imjimmy , 7/19/10 1:44 AM
<<He (Rafa) made his first hardcourt slam Semifinal in 2008, by which time Fed had already won 13 slams!>>

Don't you know that Rafa is near 5 years younger than Federer ? Rafa made his first hardcourt GS Semifinal at AO 2008. It was for around 4 months before his 22th birthday. By the same age, Federer has not won any GS ! Federer won the first GS for around 1 month before his 22th birthday (Wimbledon 2003).
Rafa won first GS at the age of 19 (2 days after his birthday).

@isabeau77 , 7/20/10 3:00 AM
<<My God, I cant believe you people are already talking about Del Potro being number 1 by 2012, are you nuts>>

It's Federer's dream (It seems that he does not like Nadal to be #1).

From Roger Federer Interview at Wimbledon on June 30, 2010:
==Question: Some of these big, flat hitters seem to be having an effect on you. Do you need to alter your game to adjust to that?

ROGER FEDERER: Well, if I'm healthy I can handle those guys, you know. Obviously it's a pity that Del POTRO is not around, because I think he would have a run at world No. 1 or a run at another Grand Slam. It's unfortunate for him.

But, you know, he's been playing well, and these guys do play very well. I played these guys 10 times. They're not going to reinvent themselves in a year, you know.

But I'm definitely struggling at the moment. That's a bit disappointing.==

Read more in: News & Photos: Interviews, R Federer - 30 June 2010 Wednesday, 30 June 2010
http://www.wimbledon.org/en_GB/news/interviews/2010-06-30/201006 301277912137533.html

Its hard to compare age at winning slams as players mature differently. Maybe we can try to compare their achievements based on what they had achieved within certain years in the tours, or number of attempts at a slam before winning it. Of course Rafa winning the FO at first attempt was exceptional, same with Wilander winning his at first attempt and I think Becker too at Wimbledon, if I'm not wrong.

If we look at Fed, it took him five attempts to reach the final and winning it at AO; likewise for his Wimbledon and USO wins. It took Rafa five attempts too to reach his first final at AO and winning it; three attempts at Wimbledon to reach his first final there and winning it on his fifth attempt in 2008. It took Fed 8 attempts at the FO to reach his first final and winning it on his 11th attempt! Rafa on the other hand, had not reached the USO final after seven attempts (from 2003-2009), well he still has time to do so.

It seems to me that Fed and Rafa almost have similar paths to their winning the slams (other than Rafa at the FO). They both have difficulties winning the slam on their respective worst surface. This is Fed's twelfth year in the tours and he has 16 slams and still counting. Rafa is in his ninth year now, having eight slams and still counting. Fed in his ninth year, ie 2007 has won 12 slams; for Rafa, he has 8 now and should he wins USO, the maximum he can get to is 9. Of course we have to bear in mind that Rafa was hampered by injury last year and that had effectively cost him one full year of slam winning opportunities (as after coming back from injury, he had to slowly get back to his winning ways).

Can Rafa match Fed's achievements of 16 slams by his twelfth years in the tours? Who knows, only time will tell. Till then, what I can say is that Fed and Rafa are great and exceptional champions. Whatever one achieves will not diminish the achievements of the other. They can have their own legacy, records and legions of fans without negatively affecting the other.

@luckystar , 7/21/10 11:43 AM
<<This is Fed's twelfth year in the tours and he has 16 slams and still counting. Rafa is in his ninth year now, having eight slams and still counting. Fed in his ninth year, ie 2007 has won 12 slams; for Rafa, he has 8 now and should he wins USO, the maximum he can get to is 9>>

Yes, Rafa turned pro nine years ago, in 2001, but he was then only 15 years old. According the rules of ATP, players under the age of 16 are not allowed to play in as many tournaments as adults. So, 2003rd was the first year when Rafa could play the full season as an adult.

From ATP World Tour - RULEBOOK:
7.02 Entries
A.Gender / Age Limitation
...Players under the age of sixteen (16) are subject to the following entry restrictions in ATP World Tour or ATP Challenger Tour tournaments (includes entry as a wildcard):
...
3) Male players aged fifteen (15) shall be eligible for entry into a maximum of twelve (12) ATP World Tour and ATP Challenger Tour tournaments.

von -

u r allowed to hope :)

Augustina, of course I know the ATP rules. In fact Rafa's first ATP tour level tournament was in 2002 at his hometown Malloca. In 2003, he also took part at some challengers events. It was until he turned 17 that he started to take part in slams, and that's why his first ever slam appearance was at Wimbledon 2003.

Fed started his first slam at the FO in 1999. Back then he was also competing in some challenger events. Unless Rafa can get to 12 slams next year, he won't be able to match Fed's speed at collecting slams. Rafa was hindered by his injury/injuries, if not he most likely will be on target (he still can be on target though and I hope he can). As I've mentioned earlier on, Fed and Rafa's path are almost similar where winning slams is concerned.

Anyway, they both are great champions. Regardless of how many slams Rafa wins by the end of his tennis career, he is already making history. He most likely will cement his status as the best clay court player ever, and I foresee him holding the record for the most no. of masters titles won and most likely the most FO titles too! I hope he gets his USO title too to complete his career slam. Well as his fan, I hope he will reach legendary status one day, though regardless of whatever he can or may achieve, I still love him all the same. I just wish for good things for him.

@luckystar , 7/21/10 1:17 PM
<<It was until he turned 17 that he started to take part in slams, and that's why his first ever slam appearance was at Wimbledon 2003>>
Rafa was then already 17 years old. He was born on June 3, 1986.

<<Fed started his first slam at the FO in 1999>>
Federer started at AO in 1999 (he was then 17,5 years old).


<<Unless Rafa can get to 12 slams next year, he won't be able to match Fed's speed at collecting slams>>
Nobody knows what the future will bring. Let's see. I am happy, if Rafa wins, and feel pain if he loses.

Augustina, are you going into details? Please check the ATP website! Fed DID NOT play at the AO in 1999. I'm right to say that he started his slam at FO 99. As to why he didn't take part at the AO that year, I'm afraid only he knows. Whether he is 17, 17.5 or 18 years old, does that make any difference??

Of course I know Rafa turned 17 on 3 June 2003. So he couldn't participate at the FO 03 because he was 'under age', so the next slam available was Wimbledon 03, so he was 17 years and one month old. Does that matter??

Of course nobody knows what the future holds, that is precisely what I mentioned in my previous posts!! Win or lose, it is part of the game, why should you feel pain? I only feel sad on two occasions - Wimbledon 07 and FO 09. Why, because I know they meant a lot to Rafa; and the way the Parisian crowd treated Rafa at the FO last year was simply atrocious, that's why I was very upset then. Well all these are in the past now, Rafa is back to his winning ways and he is a lot wiser now where his scheduling is concerned. I just hope that he would not have any more injuries and that he can play and win for as long as possible.

@luckystar , 7/21/10 3:55 PM
Federer lost in the qualifying rounds of AO 1999 (according Wikipedia).
When comparing Federer's and Rafa's achievments, their age matters.
I feel happiness or pain because I am a player fan, in the first place. I couldn't watch FO 2009, USO 2009 and AO 2010 after Rafa's loss, it was too painful.

Augustina, why does age matter? As I mentioned, players mature differently. What matters is what they go on to achieve in their careers. What is the point of starting early, winning early and then stop winning anymore at a young age? It does not mean that Rafa starts early, he'll have more time to win more tournaments/slams, it just doesn't work that way. I'm glad that Rafa can overcome his injuries/low point in his career and comes back strong and started winning slams again. Nobody knows how many more slams or tournaments he can go on to win, its just that looking at things now, if everything goes on smoothly, he is on target to match what Fed had achieved at the same stage of his career, ie at 8 or 9 years in the tours. This is just another way of comparing Rafa's progress vs Fed's, it may not be the best way but it is one of the ways.

Well, may be Fed did play but lost at the qualifying rounds of AO 99; the ATP website may not show the losses during qualifying stage, but it is strange that they didn't show it but they show results of challenger or futures matches.

I'm a tennis fan and also a Rafa fan. While I'm obviously upset that sometimes Rafa lost, I would still continue watching the other matches, though may not have any vested interest, unless some players that I also liked were playing. Of course some of Rafa's losses are painful to watch, esp those that happened last year after he came back from his injuries. There is also one match that I'll always remember, that AO 08 semifinal against Tsonga; that was a shocking match and Rafa was shell shocked after losing that match. Well, that match served as a turning point in his career where hard court matches were concerned. We saw him making so much improvements in his hard court game that later on he went on to win his first hard court slam. Also, from then on, it seems that he makes sure that he'll not lose to Tsonga again. Since then he beats Tsonga every time they played, even when Rafa was not at his best during last year's Paris masters.

I can understand where you are coming from, but right now, we should be glad that Rafa has shown us what he is made of. and proven all his critics wrong.

Augustina,

It hurts when your fav player looses early or even at semis.

I am a Fed fan but even when he looses in initial stages of tournament I dont miss the remaining tournament. I just try to enjoy other players game.

Now we have many good players on their day they can anyone(Murray,djoker,Rod, Hewitt and many more).

But the problem for them is that even if they play their best agaist Nadal or Fed at their best result is almost always will be same.Both the players are so good.Nadal the greatest athelete I have ever seen (when running on the ball is concerned) and has improved other aspects of his game.His serve was not that good initially now he has a good serve for faster courts also.Fed has a lot of shots that he can play.

Now Fed is missing a lot of things in his game.HIs serve, forehand , timing, instinct.Even if anyone thing is missing from his game is fine but now it looks like he has lost almost all of this.

We cant compare Fed and Nadal based on the when they started playing and when they won their first GS.

Fed always had the talent to be the best in the world and it took his own time for him to win his 1st GS.On the other hand for nadal he had the edge of coming from spain (Spain has so many clay specialist) and nadal was above all of them..He won French where no player was so dominant.

well said champ....:)

@luckystar , 7/21/10 6:52 PM
<<Augustina, why does age matter?>>

Because I don't think Rafa should have won 13 GS by year 2008 like Federer did. Let me remind You the beginning of this discussion. It started with my reaction to imjimmy's (7/19/10 1:44 AM) sentence: "He (Rafa) made his first hardcourt slam Semifinal in 2008, by which time Fed had already won 13 slams!"

'Well as his fan, I hope he will reach legendary status one day, though regardless of whatever he can or may achieve, I still love him all the same.'..........by Luckystar

Luckystar..............as far as i am concerned, Rafa is already LEGEND!!!!!!!!!!!!!

VAMOS!!!!

Augustina - I know your very first post concerning this subject was in response to imjimmy's. Of course comparing the achievements of a 28/29 years old now with that of a 24 years old would not be a fair one, and that's why in my posts, I suggested comparing based on no.of years in the atp adult tours rather than comparing achievements based on their physical age. Your point still stands of course (ie not to compare Fed's achievements at age 29 against Rafa's at age 24, five years is too wide an age gap anyway).

Monalysa - of course you can consider Rafa as a legend in the game. However, my definition of a 'legend' is one who is considered to be at the top tier of the game, regardless of whichever era, in other words, one of the all time greats, just like Fed, Sampras, Borg, Laver. I hope Rafa will end up in the same league as these selected few.

Hellleerr, I thought this thread is all about Delpo's possible comeback?

Exactly Raindrops. Don't know why always end up becoming more a Rafa vs Fed thread. I think it all started with naming Delpo as the future no.1, and speculations being made about when he'll take over from Rafa, and then.... Rafa's achievements vs Fed's!!??

Back to Delpo, I think he has to be careful when returning to the weekly grinding of the atp tours. I hope he does not rush things just because he wants to save his ranking from falling to depressing level. In my opinion, it will take him longer than 6 months (I revise it from 3-6 mths to a longer period) to actually get back his game and trust his wrist again. We see how Rafa was affected 'mentally' by his knee injury after he came back to the tours, not running too much, not putting too much pressure on his knees, in other words, not 'trusting' his knees too much. It will be the same for Delpo, or it may be worse, as I think wrist injury affects one's game more than knee injuries would.

That's pretty most likely luckystar, Delpo will certainly cautious upon his return from injury to not to re-injure the same joint of his forehand, thus it will affect the result of his matches. I am not saying that he will lose at early rounds but it is going to be an excellent recuperiation of his if he will hit the high gear like before and reach HC Slam QF or Semi to think that there are lots of good HC players these days. One thing for sure, Delpo will return RUSTY just like everybody else that are being sidelined with physical injury.