The true character of a man is revealed in times of adversity. Sportsmanship is tested, not when the athlete is winning but when he is losing.

I have stated this a lot of times in the past. Federer is NOT a good sportsman.

Me too phoenix. I have often said it's easy to be graceful when you are winning. I have seen Federer lose his cool many times, he also used the 'f' word in the final against Nadal at Wimbledon in 2007.

Rafa is the true gentleman; always gracious in defeat and always accepting bad decisions with poise.

Federer dropped both the S and F bombs at Garner, not just the S bomb that was heard on national TV.

But, phoenix and carrie, let's be honest. This would not even be news if it was anyone other than Federer (and Nadal, of course). It's only news because it is so rare for Federer. Just like the racket throw in Miami; if that had been anyone else, it would have been a non-story.

But yes, I agree that Nadal is in a league of his own when it comes to sportsmanship.

"It was tough luck today, but I you thought Juan Martin played great", said Federer. "I thought he hung in there and gave himself chances, and in the end was the better man".

...and thats the guy who is not gracious is defeat eh ?

He did not agree with the umpire letting them walk back to the chair then allowing the challenge which was wrong BTW . ...thats the issue at hand ...discuss that shall we .

and btw ...there is nothin fake about the FedExpress ...he speaks his mind regardless of what the world thinks .Thats the beautiful part . He is no broken tape recorder and the i think if he is pissed or happy about something we should see it .....i would take someone like that anyday over someone who has dual personalities off and on court .

C'MON!!

ricky i think the point is that the media doesn't pick him up on a number of other things. it's not just racket smashing and f-words. his claws come out when he loses, esp big matches. so when things like this happens, it's only natural that those who have followed closely will take note again. but i agree, anyone else and it wouldn't matter, but are those 'anyone else' hailed as great being sportsmen, humble, polite, poise, etc. that when they swear people sit up and take note? this isn't fed's fault, it's the media and his fans.

"But yes, I agree that Nadal is in a league of his own when it comes to sportsmanship." - RickyDimon , 9/15/09 9:12 AM

I'm glad that you at least agree that Nadal displays better sportmanship than Federer (my interpretation of what you said above). :-)
Seriously speaking, there are instances in the past where bad behaviour by Federer was not reported in the media but I saw it myself. Like that game where he broke a racket, then did not shake the hands of his opponent. The media stopped here. They did not report that he also throw water bottles around for the ball girls to pick up. That sight to me was very arrogantand coming from a player who is awarded the sportsman of the year for several years.

I can't say it wasn't expected..It is just Fed. He is so sweet when he wins, but when he loses ( especially when he is so sure that he'll win) real Fed come out...I just hope that he won't be awarded as "sportsman of the year" again... :)
I think Nole deserves that one this year... :)

The real Federer face comes out when he's loosing, then, he simply can't control himself, that's the real Federer, otherwise, he's acting all the time, as I said million times, he's great player, but personality, attitude, behaviour, way of talking, commenting, expressing himself, and the million other things, telling us, he's not a sportsman at all, he's selfish, he just wanna take it all, I'm sorry, not this time, Delpo gave him a lesson, congratulation once again...

i did not see the match but hearin fed using the f word is really quite surprising to me.......i never thought federer ever behaved like that on court after he started winning slams....i heard he was notorious in his early yrs......but NOW???....STRANGE

Ricky we haven't seen this kind of behaviour from Federer because he is not usually on the losing side, when he is he gets very angry. As I said he used the 'f' word in the Wimbledon final in 2007 when he was sure Rafa's ball was out, and hawkeye said it was , right under the umpire's chair.

Saying that this is highlighted only because it is rare for Federer to behave like this, is really unfair to all the players who are at the losing end all the time, and manage to keep their cool.

corr.
.... .........Wimbledon final in 2007 when he was sure Rafa's ball was out, and hawkeye said it was IN, right under the umpire's chair. Rafa was ahead in the match at the time.

At his press con, Federer claimed that the shot between his legs shown in the picture above was deliberate, everyone knows it was pure chance. What humility?

Tick tack, tick tack, tick tack...

Duro, hahaha...you said it all in 2 words. :D

Well, Nadal's English is not that good that he would use the F-word anyway. Even if he cussed in Spanish, no one will take notice because it's not English.

When Fed was young, he always had temper, so he loses 1 out of 1000 occasions, who cares man?

Fact still remains he has got good year being in 4 finals in all GS. Too bad he lost, but I dont feel bad, because a streak is meant to be ended anyway.

torres, can't let this on pass, if anyone swears in any language it will be picked up by the micrphones, and spanish is spoken by loads of people, someone would have picked up on it by now, if Rafa did it.

hey torres9, if you want to concern about other languages, did you see a video in which your FedEx use f-words from French and German? Yes, it was, two languages in a short clip (from a practice session). Federer's mother tongue is not English, so you know, I just don't want to talk more.

Federer is a really genius, but being a genius doesn't mean he is also perfect when it comes to Sportsmanship. I have to say that Fed Ex has been acting time over time, not only because of himself, but his sponsors and the media too.

wow , Nadal's fan are on the top of the world because Roger lost ,wow how pathetic that is:
1- Serena Williams lost a match point due to double warning if Nadal had double warning for each time he take a minute between serves, how many matches would he lost?
2- if Nadal had such a great sportamanship why he made all the drama before the torny starts and wait the draw to come to find out he go Murray and disturb the whole schadual
3- what about the Djoko gornada? wow? dont go there please? lets not forget the Roddick problem last year when he spoke to the american crowd?

you guys are flies over a corps,ugly and dirty god you are sick people

Haha... that's what funny. I'd understand if Nadal wins USO LOL...

So Fed cusses still he doesn't delay time between play like Nadal does adn do not celebrate annoyingly like Nadal does which is more unsportsmanlike if you know what sportsmanship is.

So he cusses once in awhile. And he said 'I don't give a ****'. It's not like he said, 'Delpo is a ******** or **** or ******'. LOL...

yes everyone. this is unfortunate. that federer said the "f" word. but please. lets put things into perspective here.
he is NOT ungracious in defeat. AT ALL. and it surprises me that some rafa fans want to have a go when its the "only thing" you have to go on. I watched the match - sky sports - until 2.30 this morning where they were discussing this point. Federer saying two swear words. and why? well - apparently - and RICKY no doubt you will confirm this - as this is what was being discussed by both Annabel croft and Greg Rudseksi - there is an "unwritten rule" which needs to be clarified by the ATP - that a player should be allowed to challenge a call within 2 to 5 seconds of the initial shot - delpo took more than 10 seconds. FACT. This is what Federer was "p**sed off about as he was able to challenge on a previous call the previous match - this time the umpire left it too long. (and Federer complainedd rightly so in THEIR VIEW) - go watch the interview and listen to the audio. Annabel croft said, she had been in EXACTLY the same position, (and she really is a lady) and Gred Rudsezki said exactly the same had happened to him, but Greg said he was worse, much more temperamental. And I am sorry. but if we are talking about saying the "F**k word. I counted Andy Murray saying that word 18 times in the USOpen. Nothing happened. and thats NOT including the amount of times he said it at Wimby and the FO (audible for the microphones and enough for the narrator to apologise to the TV viewers). Do you know why? because EVERYONE expects it from Andy. And that's okay? No. It isn't. Fed says it, and its like the worst possible thing the guy has done.Be fair rafa fans. It isnt acceptable in any circumstances.But what about Serena yesterday?C'MON! be fair. And actually, carrie we know (as fed fans - how wonderful rafa is), but he isn't perfect. No one is. Why cant you just applaud federer for all the WONDERFUL BEAUTY that he has brought to tennis. instead of focusing on one thing. its almost as if you have been "waiting for this moment" - so unfair of you to be saying this.really. MCEnroe, Connors, Nastase were famous for their "lack of manners" on court -because you want to have a go at Federer for this, is just completely unfair. I know he shouldnt have said it. But he did. and he was also quick to apologise. Was serena? No. Was Mcenroe? No. Connors? No. Nastase? No. Give him a break.
Federer is fodder for journalists. he is their bread and butter. Without federer, what the hell would they write about. So you focus on this one thing and feel happier about it? what does that say about all of you as tennisfans? This gives you all a chance to say horrible things about federer on what is a "difficult" enough day for his fans. Thankyou. Its hard enough as it is.
As you said zero, being a real genius, doesnt mean hes perfect. but he hasnt worn awards in this sport for the last 6 years for nothing. Because so often, he is perfect, so often he is gracious, 99.9% of his tennis career. It is just that we are so used to him being perfect, ALL THE TIME. that when he "slips", people become assanine about it. If anything, it shows how passionate he was about the point, how much it meant to him. and you all want him to have another "meltdown". Its rubbish. You think its okay that people smash rackets? (and we are talking about "all the time") - gonzo, novak, roddick (who is also another one who swears) - and the broadcasters have to apologise. so cmon guys. be fair. carrie, do you feel better now that federer has lost? how sad. i just get the feeling you have been waiting for this moment. not nice. in fact, very insensitive.

tennislover...did anyone hear Nole saying F word to umpire EVER? He had a lot of chances to use it in his match against Fed but he DIDN'T...last year, after match with Roddick, did he say to the crowd: "F*** you all!" I don't remember he did...And...last, but not least: HE HAS NEVER BEEN SPORTSMAN OF THE YEAR!!!! SO, pls, leave Nole alone....

maxi, firstly it's not just rafa fans who have issues with fed's mouth and sportsmanship. secondly, this NOT the first time he's been ungracious tho i don't think it's a big deal in itself. if you have watched fed closely for the last 6-7 years, listened to his interviews, read about him, and you were honest, you would know better. when you lose, you credit the victor. you don't say you gave the match away the other person didn't win it; or not necessarily the better player wins it's all about momentum (AO09); or sure it's difficult for me to lose over a bit of light (Wimb08); or sure rafa was awakward because he knew he couldn't beat roger federer by that scoreline (FO08). of course there are factors why he lost in the past but it's what he choses to say - brining it back to himself - rather than giving credit to the that leaves a bad taste in the mouth of many - except his most loyal fans who insist on looking at him through their rose tinted glasses.

tennislover,

we are not discussing nadal here. we are discussing federer's arrogance and use of foul language!!!
besides, we are always on top of the world, even in defeat, because of rafa's character and sportsmanship. he never ever puts his fans to shame.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQobBsmRhWQ
winner of the sportsmanship award

Billy Idol-Roger Federer 16:15! Tick tack, tick tack, tick tack...

homos-really-am not going to get in a fight over this- i promise you-i love federer, yes of course. he should not have said the "F" word homos. I watched the match-getting into bed at around 2.30 am (so forgive the irritability that may be coming through),its unfair tho to knock him-its ONE time he said this word, and he said through the mic that Juan was "THE BEST" in the match today. He also said the same in interview - i'll cut and paste it here for you in an hour or so - its on tennis.x and been over there, feeling a bit more "love" over there. I just dont understand why rafa fans have to have a go all the time. these are unfortunate times. bad day at the office today for roge (as tennislover said), but i dont think there is a need to kick a man down when he is down. Murray gets away with it all the time and so does roddick. just ask for everyone to be fair. it seems impossible tho' homos.

Maxi, don't get caught in that net. Your guy is the GOAT. Don't lose your energy over nothing. Be in pain when so. This is how you should pay tribute to your king. Don't mind any comments, you could only hurt yourself and fix nothing. Vultures eat dead meat, remember?

You know this is why tennis is considered a 'sissy' sport : the fact that we're even talking about this. Has anybody ever watched the NFL or boxing? Cursing is the norm. The reason he did was because the guy told him to be quiet. He's not a kid in school, he's a man. Freedom of speech.

Here is a youtube video of Federer swearing at Wimbledon 2007, this is not an isolated incident, if he lost more matches, he would do it more:

http://www.tennisclip.com/media/165/Roger_Federer_Swears_at_W imbledon_2007_Final/

Maxi...I don't mean any disrespect or anything...but i am tired of you talking about Tennis-X
A lot of us visit other sites..so..what is the big deal!:)
Are you a recruiter for them or something!

chr18...tennis is considered last "gentleman" sport on planet...ON PLANET...your stupid sports like baseball, or NFL...who gives damn about them...nobody out of USA don't know the rules...nobody cares...so the last thing we need in tennis is that kind of atittude...
Freedom of speech...yeah...but civilised speech...
Yes, it not usual that we hear ExFed that way...but loved and supported all medias speech about his greatnes, his divine person...
"Shadow was on ground..."...when he played with Nole he didn't complained...
His LUCKY shoot was great, beautiful...but it was LUCK...he said right after match: "Yes, we practice that shoot, but it never works..." We all heard that...and now what...it was intentional...pathetic...
And ones more to go back to Nole...what R U speaking about...what kind of incident...NY crowd didn't like Nole respond to Roddick's bul..it...and that incident.
Nole just told the true...without kissing a..es to noone.
As commentator on eurosport UK said, it was not wise, but it was brave and proud serbian is not afraid to say what he think. That is real honesty...not Exfed's dillusions and cheap diplomacy...

maxi if you're gonna paste fed's interview here for me, don't bother. i read the whole thing today. i agree he said a lot of nice things about delpo. that's not the issue i'm discussing here. i don't want to get into a fight too. people just need to accept that none of the players are perfect - no one is! but this is a blog and we're having a discussion-preferably in a reasonable way. however i don't think we should dwell on the same topic, it's not ice for the fans of the player. alternatively, if you suspect anything offensive, maybe stay away from this thread or you'll do your head in. we don't have a go all the time at fed. what than do you think we should discuss on this particular thread? sharapova's shoulder injury??

Oh yes...It is at least much more beautiful thread...(not only shoulder)...:-)
Let them do their job...bring here Nole, Rafa, Marat...pathetic...

Alik, sorry mate. you are right. i do talk about tennis.x and i'll stop. no offence intended, but i take your point. :)
homos - okay - (was going to cut and paste, but you read it - so peace). BUT am glad you ACKNOWLEDGED all the positive things roge said about delpo - i appreciate that homos :)
duronole - yes. you are right. difficult not to get involved when you want to support your fave player - you'd do the same with novak tho', right? but thank you - :)
see you at the AO buddy. best wishes to novak and his new team and trainer todd martin.
to those of you who have nothing nice to federer except concentrate on ONE INCIDENT - you are jackals/carrion feeders who have nothing better to do and that is what makes me feel sad. you wanna talk about swearing? go check out the murray "swearing" on youtube - hundreds of them - that should keep you happy.
POSITIVE THINGS ROGER SAID ABOUT DELPO:

Talk about the experience tonight and the way Juan Martin played.

- So it was tough luck today, but I thought Juan Martin played great. I thought he hung in there and gave himself chances, and in the end was the better man.
- Especially nice when it comes when you're quite young because it comes kind of unexpected for him as well even though he put himself in a good opportunity and position. But it's great. It was good to see him being so happy and emotional about it.

Yeah, I mean, he should enjoy it. He deserves it. It was a great match for him, too.

But, you know, you can't have them all and can't always play your best. He hung in there and did well. In the end, he was just too tough.

ROGER FEDERER: Well, I mean, I guess, yeah. It's always an amazing effort coming through and winning your first in your first final. Got to give him all the credit because it's not an easy thing to do.
So his effort was fantastic.
In the end, was really good.

He has a great technique at backhand. Rock solid.

ROGER FEDERER: No problem. He deserved it. He played well. I wish him all the best for the future. That's for sure.

those of you that think roger doesnt EVER give praise to his opponents - read this and take note. the full interview is "you know where" (see alik:)).

homos. i wont get into a fight over the best tennis player in history who had a bad day at the office, who has brought me such an entertaining display of tennis (especially against novak - THAT SHOT - THAT EXCHANGE OF VOLLEYS FROM BOTH PLAYERS - AMAZING.
wishing all decent fans the best of everything tennis has to offer. (thank you duronole and ollyk in particular).

oh my... sounds like a personality tournament going on here... who's the most graceful... who's the less fake one.... hahahaha... and the winner is....?

The guy didn't even abused anyone. He sais Don't tell me ***** what to do. And I dont give a ****.

That is not in any case, abusive to another person. It's more like a rant.

It's not like he said, 'Delpo and you can **** each other'... LOL

bad sportsmanship is when Delpo asked for the point to be replayed when federer served an ace while it was clear he was playing the ball.

torres - the ballboy was moving behind Federer. Del Potro could see it and thus was distracted. Federer could not see it.

If anything was bad sportsmanship, it was Federer not giving the point to Djokovic in their semifinal match.

Oh, so the Fed is the umpire now? Good one, Ricky.

ricky, when a tennis player is concentrating on hitting ball - it requires pure focus - you dont know if federer saw the ball - so dont even go there - its very unsportsmanlike - i see your post was very pro gonzo when he was accused of the ball "hitting" his racquet, but then i guess when you are the best tennis player in the world, you are alway going to have jealous people around you with snidy half baked comments when they dont know the full story. why dont you do a direct interview and find out the "real" truth, its just all sooooo pointless. i also find it amazing that one incident in a grand slam final - hello? pressure.pressure? can turn into a fedhate fest. its disgusting.

"Oh, so the Fed is the umpire now? Good one, Ricky."
torres9
, 9/15/09 6:40 PM

That's the point torres--LOL. fed ISN'T the umpire so therefore cannot make the final decision.

I remember that instance in the Nole match Ricky because JMac and Carillo BOTH said they were surprised that fed didn't speak up and give the point to Nole.

Yeah..and it was such great sportsmanship when Nadal rooked a point off Roger when his serve was clearly in, in the Madrid final isnt it?
Picking apart these instances can be done on both sides.And dont raise the Nadal is 'holier than thou' card.There are instances when he has been pretty far from it.

Haha f4t, that's not too smart.

1st you said Fed isnt the umpire therefore cannot make the final decision.

And then you said he should make the decision for the umpire.

BRILLIANT, f4t, JUST BRILLIANT!!!

tennislover, i'm a nadal fan and i'm not celebrating because roger lost, i'm happy because God showed up and showed everyone that you can't do others wrong and get by. every year nadal has to watch roger lay up in his hotel room and rest for three or four days, get the schedule he wants, etc, and everyboyd defends it as if it's alright. nadal plays at night, whenever they decide to play him, in the rain or in the fire or whatever. they did all of this to him, but roger still didn't win, because in my mind, it's was wrong and a lot of people know it and go along with it. john & patrick mcenroe and others forgot one huge thing when planning roger's win, they don't have the power to know the future. i'm not so caught up in tennis that i think nadal should win every time he steps on t he court. the difference in people like you and i when it comes to tennis is that i know nadal has weaknesses and can lose any given day, i accept his losses and move on. when nadal losses, injury or no injury, most of you guys talk about him like a dog. on the other hand, wh en roger loses, it's said that he just had a bad day, his serving was off, etc. so, it's not about me wanting roger to lose, it didn't matter to me if he had gotten six usopens or not, but integrity and equality alway matter to me!

Maxi...one incident???
Did you saw links here...I remember "Chalenge this!!!" to Nadal...
"I will speak when I want...?"
How many time there was "Schai.e"...german word for S word...
It is not like Serena...but it is complet lack of respect to umpire, to his colegue...another player...and to millions spectators all arounf the world.
Maxi...you, exfedfan, tennislover...you are supporting that image when ExFed come out from toilet ...it' smely like flower blossom.
Well my friend he is just one player in one game with strickt rules. And they should be same for everyone.
...and ofcourse Nole would said without thinking if the ball was good...you can find lot of examples of Nole's sportmanship. Six chalenges...six...and Mr Arogant Perfect is just lowering his head...not a word!!!
So don't speak about fed haters...speak about facts.

I agree with the first poster. The media built up this myth that federer was some kind of uberclass gentleman that we should all aspire to be, but the reality is that it's easy to act all classy when you're winning and the world is kissing your feet. The true measure of a man's character comes when he is tested, and federer has always failed that test of class in the face of adversity. He behaves like a spoiled, arrogant brat whose toys are being taken away from him, and his sense of entitlement is obnoxious. He clearly thought del potro was beneath him as a person and a player and should not win against his royal highness but I am so happy del potro put the federer myth to rest and that we won't have to see the swiss smugly holding up that trophy again (or wearing some stupid jacket with "15" on it). Thank you, Juan!!

"That's the point torres--LOL. fed ISN'T the umpire so therefore cannot make the final decision.

I remember that instance in the Nole match Ricky because JMac and Carillo BOTH said they were surprised that fed didn't speak up and give the point to Nole."
fan4tennis 9/15/09 6:48 PM

"Haha f4t, that's not too smart. 1st you said Fed isnt the umpire therefore cannot make the final decision.And then you said he should make the decision for the umpire.BRILLIANT, f4t, JUST BRILLIANT!!!"
torres9 9/15/09 6:55 PM

The first part of my response was to the instance that Delpo requested another serve because of the linesperson moving, which fed could not see, yet fed argued as he should make the call.

Second part of my response was about an instance in the Nole match, where fed conveniently never said a word when Nole argued a point he should've won. Even the commentators, plus me with my bad eyes could see it was a wrong call. Janhavi must know exactly what point I'm talking about since he talks of other players rooking a point, as if that makes it all okay. We all now know the fed isn't afraid to open his mouth and say something, but he was strangely mute then.

memi, zare, f4t, phoenix, carrie and sheila - i think it's time we tried a pair of those rose-tinted glasses the fanatics wear. it must be nice to think your fav player is perfect, and the greatest human on the planet that everyone else is so jealous they want to put him down at any and all costs.

or maybe he just dosent trust the hawkeye which is why didnt give the point?Take note,that Roger did concede a point to Novak in that same match before Novak even challenged because he himself could see the ball was in.There was a similar scenario in the Wimbledon SF when Haas's ball was called out by the hawkeye and the margin was next to nothing.Roger asked if they could replay the point because he didnt want Haas to lose the point-the umpire it seems didnt allow it and Haas had to lose the point eventually.

homos, don't be surprised if they remove hawkeye per roger federer request!

i totally agree with you memi but it is pointless arguing with these people......... as i said earlier all is fair for fed, he shud always be on the winning side and i agree with sheila too ...... fed is a class act , the perfect gentleman and a true hero till he is wining but when he is losing he is the exact opposite ........ he considers himself the best (which may be true) ...... but you become great only when u r humble and give credit to the players who beat him...... which fed truly lacks ......

When Federer is on top, some of his fans rub it all the time, with slogans, and aclaims for their god, going on and on about the GOAT, belittling everyone else, trivialising other people's victories against him, refusing to give credit to anyone else for achieving anything, then when he loses, they expect all of us to be in mourning. They were ecstatic when Soderling beat Rafa at RG, and revelled in Federer winning the title. They had no sympathy when Rafa was off injured and couldn't defend Queens and Wimbledon, and were happy when he dropped to No 3. Some of them always express their wish for whoever to beat Rafa.

I can safely say that whilst Rafans fight his corner and never fail to highlight his achievements, we do not carry offensive slogans on every post inferring that only Rafa can win everything, that he is just the best, and constantly claiming that he's got more fans than anyone else, etc etc.

When Roger's halo shifts, i.e when he swears in public during a match, or smashes his racquet, we are supposed to pretend it didn't happen, and agree that he is a perfect gentleman, who is untouchable. We are supposed to keep quiet in the face of blatant unfairness in the way he is normally favoured over the other players, which gives him an unfair advantage.

It they hadn't put him on a pedestal, then everyone would move on, but he can't be presented as this epitome of the finest tennis player that ever played the game, when the evidence is to the contrary.

maxi - "you dont know if Federer saw the ball, so dont even go there"

I have no idea what you are talking about.

The point I am talking about is when the ballboy was doing something behind Federer. Federer couldnt see it since it was behind him, so he served the ball. Del Potro was looking at it, so he saw it, and thus time was called.

deepz, so true, it's pointless to argue with these people. they'll do anything to turn the wrong things roger does into right things, but the great thing is, it is what it is and everybody watching, saw it. they may wrap what roger did in a bright, lovely wrap with a beautiful bow, but what's inside remains the same. they may put a pretty spin on it, but it won't change what actually transpired! i completely agree with you, there's more to being "great" than winning 15 majors and a host of other titles and awards. it's about the character and integrity of a man and how he reacts when his back is against the wall! it's there for everyone to see, so no need to keeping pointing it out! those who want to see the facts, will, and those who do not, won't!

Hey sky, torres, fedex, janhavi beautiful...........zoey.....dahling......how are you? First of all, i want to make P-E-A-C-E with Gordana. Gordana. I was out of order 2 months ago when i reacted to your comment to me, and I am T-R-U-L-Y S-O-R-R-Y to you. I hope we can make peace. we are not always going to agree gordana - so as you know, Administrator was not happy with me and i paid the price.......HUMBLE APOLOGIES..........................

I am glad to be back on the threads people, and look forward to future discussions with all of you (especially my homegirl Zoey - (and buddy, SKY). How are you guys? but to quickly bring you up to speed - did some massive travelling over the summer (had to do something with my spare time!!!!!!!..................)

just want to thank those of you who said you missed me - i T-R-U-L-Y, T-R-U-L-Y, appreciate that...........SenorPlaid, zoey and sky.and................................ zoey...you are the one with the A-D-O-R-A-B-L-E..........H-E-A-R-T.........and also to mdmuch - are you still in the jungle my friend?

and as for Federer.................well..was sick this morning. stayed up late to watch the match.........BUT congratulations to del potro........a worthy, winner, champion........................Federer fans will always defend their champion...............T-H-R-O-U-G-H-O-U-T................F-E-D IS THE BEST....two match points away though...Argggghhhhh! federer! Zoey, Sky, you gave me your email addresses when i went to wimbledon this year - i said i would try to get some photos for you? - could you send them to me again please - sky i just remember aztec something or other?

deepz, i have to disagree with you. Fed is humble. he has a language hiatus sometimes. i just wish people would see the best in him. The problem is he has been on the top for so long, and we as federer fans, put him there, the expectations are high........................ through the roof. I wish you could be more generous though with your thoughts on federer.............to simply zoom in...on ONE POINT....and enlarge it.....out of proportion.....is unsportsmanlike in itself........sorry deepz....fed lacks very little in my opinion........go read his interview (US OPEN OFFICIAL WEBSITE)_ more than gracious with delpo.......he is LOVED. very LOVED., so put into proportion plllleeeezzzzze. thanks deepz.

last post to fan4tennis. ................... Believe it or not FFT, I have missed you..........I have missed our conversations.........you became A......B-I-G....P-A-R-T...O-F........M-Y....L-I-F-E.....(for the wrong reasons), but hope that this can at least be a part way to resuming what will h-o-p-e-f-u-l-l-y be a more positive relationship....and congratulations on becoming a grandmother. i'll leave it there, because i dont want to overdo it.......................

Hahaha! Cannot keep up with the charade,MAXI? Now you revert back to your old self. Remember I was the first to point out that maxi and maltheser are one and the same person. But back then, I have to apologise for my "mistake".

Welcome back my friend, maltheser alias maxi.:-)

Your old pal,
Danny

ty on your congrats to me for my new grandbaby malt. Maybe you will read some of the threads and see that I have actually defended fed (ask zoey!) and given fed his props. In your words, "i'll leave it there, because i dont want to overdo it......................."

Btw is the world ranks up to date with the final being played on a monday and all?

hey malty, welcome back!!!! Our Fed is fine. Losing a final is a good showing for every other player but for Fed, it seems like it's a bad thingy.

Not to mention he outperformed everyone this year in all Slams and also is in even a better position to end the year as no.1.

Ricky, still Delpo was already swinging the racket. How bout if Fed did it? Owhhh, all the anti-Fed people are gonna be all over him saying its gamesmanship whateva LOL. Double standard.

Muzza said 'F*** u, t**t' during last year US Open but why isn't the media making a big thing about it. Because Fed won? LOL...

torres says: "Not to mention he outperformed everyone this year in all Slams"

Forgot the AO already?

FEDSHIT is really an A.Hole when irt comes to sportsmanship
He is the worst in tennis by far
The same thing in the late challenge he coomplained about he did later in the same game but delpo didn't have the challenge right while FEDSHIt benefited from the challenge
FEDSHIT had 2 out of 9 challenges right with Novak while NOvak who was clealrly beaten by unfair biassed Umpire had 8 out of 9 challenges correct
ALl umpires are screwing in favour of FEDSHIT when the ball is unclear, they always count it for FEDSHIT
Fedshit is by far the most immoral stupid player when he loses & he will lose much, more to come soon, very soon

f4t, in all Slams means overall, in general.

Fed- F, W, W, F
Nadal- W, 4th, retired, SF
Djoker- QF, 3rd, QF,SF
Muzza- 4th, QF,SF,4th
Delpo-QF,SF,2nd, W

phoenix? W-H-A-T- A-R-E.......YOU......talking about? duh?

I see lots of new posters phoenix/danny - (why did you change your name?) - went travelling in summer so didn't read ALL POSTS. The only one that is glaringly obvious who is missing though is AGF..............where he/she gone? and where is mdmuch?

fan4tennis - R-E-A-L-L-Y G-R-E-A-T to be having conflab with you again - honestly - have missed our verbal fighting - really - its all so silly sometimes - and i guess being away from TT for almost 2 months is a real eye opener fft......i truly hope that bridges can be built....but am NOT going to labour the point.......my main spat was with Gordana - (we did rub each other up the wrong way fft, as you know), but have read a lot of her posts recently...................i think apart from today....she has been pretty tame.......rock on gordana!!!!!! anyway....enough crawling......

am trying to be calm..............now federer has lost USO.....been having discussions with brother about him, and he knows how upset have been.really take things to heart. difficult............but i know federer will return...stronger......stronger......in kanye west styley.................just waiting for my homegirl to drop on by fft...and sky buddy....love 'em both.................missed 'em more.............love,love,love to both.....SKY....been so difficult not being able to respond to you....R-E-A-L-L-Y.

smartcuty i see your point but don't condone name calling.

maxi, you'll get over it! don't take it so hard! this is what the sport is about, wins & losses! you're not the only one who thought that federer had this tournament in his pocket. don't be devastated!, you're not alone, the tournament officials even bought a car to give to the winner this year,probably because they were so sure it would be roger. i'm not aware of a car being a part of the prize at the usopen before. it was suppose to be a present for roger, but del potro will be the one who gets to look "cool" driving his "cool" ride!

memi, this made me chuckle. How funny that Delpo should end up with the car. All their plans went AWOL, like targetting Nadal for the final and wearing him out only for Fed to face Delpo in the final. That'll teach them.

ok posmatrac
God bless you Phoenix, you said it all, but people are still brain washed by the acting saint of tennis whose own devil shows only when he loses
FEDSHIT=ZERRROOO IN MORALS

Admin, do something please.

that's something that i noticed too, fed's grace changes when he loses, but i may be wrong?

God bless you Carrie
God bless Nadal, Djokovic, Murray & Delpotro who irritates the arrogant proud no morals' tennis player & his brain washed fans

Posmatrac,
You are absolutely right & you will see more of it by time & by consecutive wins & return of Nadal from injury
You will see the real face of RF bursting when his defeats are lined up in row especially from Rafa (real sportsman of tennis) , Novak (best ever morals in tennis), Murray (RF ghost) & the uprising DELPO whose arm swinged hard to get out the devil's atttitude from the proud acting saint who decieved millions over the years

Smartcuty, we are not irritated especially when Fed has won 15 Slams already. Rafa (real sportman who grunts and delay time),Novak (so morally right that he was rubbing it on Roddick when he won against it in USO2008), Muzza (RF ghosts?).

And Delpo also swinged hard to destroy the mighty Nadal 6-2, 6-2, 6-2 so what r u talking about?

I also noticed that Nadal always tak about his injury when he loses and then went on to congratulate his opponent. Same what fed did juz that you are all making a big fuss about it.

you guys are crazy:D
Malt!:) welcome back....Malt said," i'm trying to stay calm:)

torres, torres, torres, babycakes, a lost is a lost whether the score is 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 or 7-6, 7-6, 7-6! who cares what the score is! del potro is not crying because he didn't win in three sets, he's driving his expensive car, chilling! anyway, what are you complaining about, after all, you have said time and time and time again that players can beat nadal, but not federer! so, it shouldn't be a surprise that delpo destroyed nadal, but how do you explain him putting a beating on roger?

Torres is a typical FEDSHITT's FAN
if you are not his i will be very surprised
Birds of same dirty feather fluck together

Most of FEDASS fan are quantity (numbers) fans who hate to see any one rising & see competition with their selfish proud goat
They talk numbers only & start counting while when you face them with the same fact they deny & avoid
FEDSHIT vs Murray head to head is 3-6 for Murray
Fedass vs Rafa head to head is 7-13 for Rafa
FEDASS when he was 23 years old he never had 6 grand slams
Moreover most of Rafa's fans love Murray & Novak Djokovic (who was slaughtered by Umpires against Fedass) in the semifinals but never swear instead raised his hands, signed the cross & asked GOD to help him playing against the UMPIRE supported FEDASS
While Fedass acted like he is upset coz or Rafa's injury, he was very very happy inside of him & jumping that his spicy Ass kicker is no longer competing in Wimbeldon
Tennis haters come on support the GOAT!!!!!!

God bless you memi
Thank you fedex because you set the standard between people
People who believes in quantity vs ppl who believe in quality
People who believe in Monopoly vs ppl who believe in fair competition
People who are proud of proudness & arrogance vs ppl who appreciates humbleness & sportsmanship
Poeple who deny & have execuses for every single defeat vs people who accept defeats & know that they are part of the game & of any sport
People who love only one & hate others vs people who love one & love others
GOD BLESS YOU RAFA, DJOKO, MURRAY, DELPO, VERDASCO & ANDY RODDICK

I definately expected # 1 in the rank to beat # 6 for sure & have solutions for his swinging tough forehand & show the world that the problem was in Nadal weakness now & not in DELPO's strength but he failed

I didn't expect Fedex to be so dramatically beaten & make all those double faults & let the ball fly out of court like a newly starting child learning how to play tennis for the first time

The funny thing is that Fedex's pride let him thought that he is the player, he is the coach & he is the Umpire too

I suggest that Fedex should also replace the fans because they should shut up when he loses & cheer only when he wins

Fedex should be alone in the court making the show: THE PROUD MAN FIGHTING HIMSELF

Look at Fedex face & see the expressions there, maybe the blind will see one day the truth, but that is hopeless case!!!!

smartcuty, thanks! likewise! you seem to have the characteristics of most fedfans & rafafans down pat! the distinctions you made between the two sound about right!

Owhh really, a guy who won 4 mercedes car from 4 Masters Cup would be so heartbroken by a guy winning a car?

Pffttt, Fed could have bought 40 of those with his prize money alone lol.

People who believes in quantity vs ppl who believe in quality - (quality of Delpo-Fed match was a lot more than Nadal's ownage)

People who believe in Monopoly vs ppl who believe in fair competition - ( fair competition is when everyone follow the time-between-points rule)

People who are proud of proudness & arrogance vs ppl who appreciates humbleness & sportsmanship
(A guy who is confident is always perceived as arrogant in any walk in life but the most dangerous ones are the ones that have an image of being humble but not truly humble)

Poeple who deny & have execuses for every single defeat vs people who accept defeats & know that they are part of the game & of any sport
(Nadal fans excuses: Rigged draw, high-altitude, wrong scheduling, not 100%... list go on)

People who love only one & hate others vs people who love one & love others (You hate Fed so much so you are in category no.1)

And we do not ignore the statistics of 13-7 and 3-6 as much as Rafans ignore the simple statistics of 15 Slams, 4 TMC, 4 yr-end no.1s

carrie , 9/15/09 8:06 PM - what an excellent post.

memi, they did the same at ao, set it all up for fed to received no. 14 - short of engraving his name on the trophy BEFORE the final - when it blew up in their faces and they were left speechless and lost when rafa spoilt the grand event.

Lexus was one of the sponsors of the USO and I don't know where people are getting that it was supposed to be ONLY for fed. I heard that they were gifting the car to the winner back in the beginning of August, long before the USO started. If you visited a Lexus dealer, it was all over the place, but it only had pics of Rafa, fed, Murray and Nole, not Delpo--lol.

fan4tennis, i'm guilty. i strongly believe that the "car idea" was done with federer in mind as with everything else! of course, they were gifting the car to the winner because they have always thought federer would be the winner! do you think they were going to admit it! of course, pics of rafa, fed, murray, novak were attached. you didn't expect them to just associate federer's picture with it, did you? they have to make it appear innocent!

f4t - don't spoil a good story! :P

MALT !!! welcome back ...we missed you on the Fed train throughout the US OPEN 09 .

C'MON !!

the car situation was situation "exactly" as last year. Federer got keys to a exus.lexus were sponsors then like they are now. i remember the blonde lady handing him the key.so what if he didnt get nuther "lexus "this year.he got one already.probably with"porsche,mercedes,ferrari"wouldnt fit in his garage anyway-
Torr,do NOT get into conversation with awful poster 'smartcuty'.cannot bleve what he saying.stick to the supporting theme.

And by the way Del Potro only won because he challenged the very biassed towards FEDASS UMPIRE in one ball which was going to be another unfair second set point for Fedass

Fedass fans who complaint for late incorrect challenge which didn't win anything for Delpo except losing one of his challeneges in vain cannot see Fedass doing the same later in the game but winning a point through this
IF a blind man leads blind people, BOTH FALL IN A DEEP SHITTT HOLE
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hi guys, I've been reading these posts right now, I have to admit, I'm pretty surprised with some, anyway, smartcuty in general I do agree with you, but such a language will cost you a lot I think, be careful, don't jeopardize your presence over here, otherwise you'll be forbidden for a while, I wouldn't like that cause your comments would be so interesting, and as your nick name says, be smart and participate like administrators want, everybody will be happy, me the most, I like you...

Thank you Gordana, I will try to be but the words of truth hurts who constantly got hurt by facing the truth & wherever there are blind hearts, the eyes will follow & cannot see

Add to FEDEX hate list of players now: Nadal-Murray-Djokovic-Del Potro
Fedex heart is eating now as his throne is endangered by a new rising star & therefore he will be working hard next few weeks to find a recipe how to put down Delpo
Poor Fedex you gota fight many now & only GOD knows how much you hate to be challenged & put into real test & hard tough competition
Fedex only likes Soderling loyal servant all the time & likes who enter the game bowing their head for the master & tell him: PLEASE PLEASE beat me up fast because i enjoy just smiling when i see your miserable black hearted revealing face
Birds of same feather fluck together

delusional........

smartcuty, where have you been, we need more posters facing the facts here. Rafa is always at the butt end of most Fedfans putting him down, delighting in his ailments and failures. Of course he doesn't always win, why should he? Why should all the other players who work equally hard play year after year and get nothing out of it. It's good when these players get some reward as well. As a fan of Rafa's, I wouldn't like him to always lose like 80% of the players always do, so good luck to any of the players who can beat a top player on the day. I don't support Rafa because IMO he is the best player in the world, I like everything he is as a tennis player, and yes, of course the fact that he is at the top of the game is a big plus as well.

Fedfans are shocked when he loses, because they believe their own propaganda, they won't face up to the fact that his game is not perfect, they won't face up to the fact that he gets more than a little help mostly in GS.. He's only won one more Masters than Rafa, even though he's been a pro longer, because he probably doesn't get as much propping up in those as he does in GS.

The slogans they put here say it all. Always counting their chickens before they are hatched. I'm glad the GOAT claim is put to rest , that is until he wins the next match.

VAMOS RAFA!

Does anyone know if the Fed has been fined for using obscene language at the USO?

another delusional rant........

i doubt it carrie. they'll probably temporarily suspend a few of his foot soldiers as punishment!!!

another delusional rant........

happyspectator , 9/16/09 11:54 AM




You don't sound very happy to me, infact you sound downright miserable, with your hands covering your eyes, so you can't see the truth even when it's is starig at you in the face.

nope... i'm fine actually...happy for JDMP for winning....happy for Fed for a pretty good season considering the start was not that great. Just kinda saddened by the language and tones used by some posters.

"Winning one Grand Slam makes a career year for most elite tennis players-- for Roger Federer, winning two is apparently a slow one." - Euno Lee

oops... the quote above maybe taken out of context. ^^ Here is the whole excerpt by the author:

"Just how great is Roger Federer? Roger Federer's dominion over the game of tennis is so awe-inspiring that the tennis world has become jaded. At the end of a year, tennis fans remember that he lost the U.S. Open and not that he won the longest Wimbledon final in history, or that he completed a Career Grand Slam by winning the French Open, or that he surpassed Pete Sampras's all-time major championships record of 14 and ended the year with 15.

Roger Federer remains atop the ATP World Rankings. He won more majors than any other player this year on top of making history, and still the kid del Potro manages to receive more attention than he does. The year, in retrospect, will be remembered for being the year Roger Federer transcended greatness into a league entirely his own.

Proving to be the greatest tennis player on the planet not just once, but in two tournaments this year, should be plenty. Winning one Grand Slam makes a career year for most elite tennis players-- for Roger Federer, winning two is apparently a slow one." - Euno Lee

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

This is just as much a rant as any other. Furthermore it is so typical of Federer fans not to give space to anyone else in their time of glory. Why should Delpo not have his time in the limelight? Me, me, me!

Carrie and smarcuty deserves each other. Both are paranoid, delusional conspiracy theorists.

They actually think Fed is losing any sleep with theis young players are rising. LOL... Well considering only 1 of them actually stopped him at USO, is it such a big thing? He was whooping Nadal, Djoker, Muzza and Delpo behinds the pat 4 month or so and only lost to Delpo and Tsonga.

Big deal. The ones who gets frustrated is the young players praying that Fed goes down because he's always there and you can never get an easy match from him even if he's older, even if he's down.

nadal must have thought he had put the monster to rest only to get beaten in Madrid.
Muzza thought he's gonna win the next 30 matches against Fed and got a whooping in Cincy

The best way is to be like Delpo, respect him and play your game. Never ever get too over-confident against the Fed.

Same like you torres, you definately deserve FEDEX because if you were not his fan i would have been very surprised
Who likes Fedex shouyld be personally like him in all his poor quality sportsmen ship
You are the last one to talk about Nadal because Nadal wish to meet FEDEX & not escape from him, it's FEdex who is in heart wish not to see Nadal in any grand slam final
13-7 for a 23 year old vs a 28 year old!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LOL

Thank you Carrie
BY the way does anyone see a player complaint from the challenge camera like Fedex
Fedex when they replay the balls & he finds them not in his favour he starts to get annoyed & show an attitude as if his own eyes are better than the camera & computers

Fedex is annoyed by the camera & challenges
Fedex is annoyed by Djokovic family & told them "BE QUIET"
Fedex is annoyed by player asking to challenge late & then he HIMSELF does the same exactly
Fedex is annoyed by Madrid fans supporting their own citizen, his rival NADAL
Fedex is annoyed by Murray leading the head to head with him 6-3

I guess fedex is annoyed that there will be another player in the other side of the court hittting the ball hard back to him, therefore fedex should be playing alone & winning alone everything............LOL
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

hi zoey lovely................how have you been.......have sooooo...soooo....missed you......

johan - yes - federer's interview was wonderful.........i dont know why so many people have to disrespect the best player, most complete tennis player EVER!
smartcuty............................ you remind me of a serial offender who will get caught very soon with your disgusting swearing, can you try to grow up-if thats possible?...................there is nothing "S-M-A-R-T"......OR "C-U-T-Y" about your comments............hopefully you wont be around for too long............

and when you are talking about federer- dont forget to say "Sir!". He's been knighted dontcha know! also. 28 years old. yes. it's so young. and after all, having played both montreal and cinny, beating a 22 and a 23 year old respectively. so i guess that kind of disputes your crazy claim.............................you conveniently forgot that, so just thought i'd remind you. LOL.

SIRRR FEDEX????????
Seriously guys you are sick by the desease of slavery as your master is
YOU ARE HIS SLAVES but not everyone!!!!
LOL

LOL smartcuty, Sampras has a losing h2h to Safin and Hewitt who was much younger than he was. Old players loses to young players all the time.

And how bout 3-4 of Delpo(20) and Nadal(23). Most of Nadal's win was when Del Potro was not having any weapons at all LOL. How does a 6-time GS winner get destroyed 6.2,6.2, 6-2 LOL...

Well, I think nadal must be even more annoyed that a player is beating him 3 times in a row and not only that he already is having it hard to chase Fed, now he has someone who eats his looping forehand.. LOL

Nadal is not annoyed neither are his fans & therefore you will find most of nadal fans cheer for Delpo, Djoko, Murray, Roddick, Verdasco...etc
You guys are the ones who hate competition & want FEDEDX to win all
IF you love competition you wouldn't have been FEDEX fan, so simple

torres9 i hardly think Rafa will be annoyed with Delpo instead he will be working hard to beat him next time around........ and did you say 6-2,6-2,6-2 as destroyed then what will you call 6?1, 6?3, 6?0 ( total demolition??????????), does the score card ring a bell ?????? And how does a 12 (then!!!!) time grand slam champion not manage to get a single game in the final set ...... hey torres9 before you make a statement just think .......

'hey torres9 before you make a statement just think ......." -deepz , 9/16/09 6:59 PM

Tough act to ask from the guy, deepz. A rabid fanatic is thinking with his _ss. :-)

Deepz@vamosrafa, at least Fed never lost that way in a GS surface he just won as near as the beginning of the year... LOL...

Smartcuty, u juz came here and you act like you know who cheers for who. How presumptuous. Rafans have been hating Fed(including u) so much and you are saying fedfans is spreading the hate. How delusional.

phoenix, hello rabid Nadal fan

No torres9, i'm a tennis fan. I like Rafa, Nole, AndyM, AndyR, Verdasco, Ferrer, now delpo,etc. Come to think of it, I like all tennis players except two: Federer and Soderling.
See, I'm not drooling like you do. :-)

Btw, torres, what happened to Fed'd 16GS jacket? I'm sure he had one ready at the finals just like in Wimby. Did he give the jacket to you? How do you intend to share it with maltymaxi and fedexfan? :-)

Same with me Phoenix
You like & dislike exactly the ones who deserve in quality of play & real sportsman-ship
Great Taste:)

phoenix, go to a lottery shop and give 626262 and you just might win yourself a lot of Humiliation LOL....

And I doubt you are a tennis fan. You are just a Fed-hater. Same goes to you, smatcuty. Stop pretending.

You are redundant torres. I already stated that I don't like Federer. Don't over-emphasize it by saying that I hate him as well.

Hate is too strong a word to use in this forum, don't you think? :-)

Torres,
I hate to tell you this that I played tennis for 25 Years & coached it for the last 5 years, so just have a life with your FEDEX!!!

Torres,
You are entitled for whom you support & don't support
You are upset coz we don't like YOUR FEDEX, while at the same time you hate Nadal no matter what.
We have reasons not to like FEDEX which are related more to his attitude & personalty before his style of play & not because he is the the rival of Nadal because Nadal came during FEDEX domination & not vice versa
Your hatred to Nadal is related to him rising against ALMIGHT Fedex & threat his crown & put him down to # 2 for almost one year before he got injured
You guys will never admit it but that is for sure big part of the story

I would like to say that i don't Hate anyone.I dislike federer's attitude and his persoanlity.

Have you every heard of the phrase,"your ways carry you a long way"
well..it doesn't matter what you do in life or what you have..if you are rude and a nasty person...none of that matters.That is how i feel about federer.

I think that he is a great tennis player but i refuse to be a fan of someone like him.
Not all rafa fans Hate federer

other words...dislike his attitude not his tennis skills

alik, many before you have tried to explain the same thing to some fed fans - but they cannot differentiate between his tennis and his attitude. If you criticize his attitude, they see as belittling his tennis and his achievements - and they also take it personally, as if you are attacking them.

i'm glad you said "some fed fans" homos-i think we can differentiate between his attitude and his tennis tho-try to be fair-we know he should NOT swear homos-it isnt great at all-thats a given.however, what is upsetting is that this horrible episode seems to have given some "rafa fans" the right to go on and on about it, and degrade federer's accomplishments to such an extent that it completely wipes out what he has done for the game. thats the injustice.nothing more than that. and lets face it. i have come to learn that "many rafafans" take it personally when anyone so much as criticises rafa for anything-so it works both ways.
alik-if you dont mind me saying, federer's "attitude" has been described (prior to the USO final"), as "great","charming","exemplary".dont let this incident or what he has done for the sport, cloud your judgment of him. its so unfair. i've stayed away from some of the comments made about roger, because they are horrible. would you rather he not be playing tennis? seriously?

Alik,
Well said, cannot be said better, simple, short & straight to the point
Very good opinion & right on the target
I can't agree more

"The best way is to be like Delpo, respect him and play your game. Never ever get too over-confident against the Fed"

lol,so now Rafa has to learn from Del Potro how to beat Roger? I bet you're gonna start disliking Del Potro too if he's also gonna be a nemesis of Roger just like Rafa is.

Maxi,
Finally here is one post from Fedex's fan that is reasonable, worth reading & responding.
As Homos & Alik said most of who dislike Fedex base their opinion on his attitude & not on his style of play or achievements
Neither me nor any fair tennis fan can deny that Fedex is a top player, even though sometimes his games are not that entertaining
The best games I watched for him ever are all his final games with Nadal in grand slams, his final with Andy Roddick in Wimbledon 2009 & his Cinncinati 2009 performance against Murray & Djokovic
So his way of playing doesn't bother us as much as his personalty & attitude in the court & it's very unfair to judge just based on the last incidence in Delpo's game
Fedex has history before but it wasn't highlighted:
1-Shut up Djoko's family even though the ball was out already
2-He occasionally put himself in situations of not accepting the camera & computer challenges when he loses them & start murmering & showing red face
3-He quits from signing autographs for fans ate good times when he is winning in a very proud way
4-He praises himself occasionally even after he loses & in all his advertisement
MR/FEDEX: Please let your fans praise you not you praise yourself
5-Finally he acts like he is the player, coach, umpire & fans: doesn't he know that every component in the game has his own role?
Why was he upset that Madrid 2009 fans were supporting Nadal & afterFedex won tease them saying: GUYS I AM SORRY I UPSET YOU & MADE YOUR NIGHT DARK & MISERABLE
Comments like that should not come from a champion like him, he is not a kid teasing others at school

On the orther hand many Fedex's fans pick on Nadal just because his body is built in a way that his butt let the short sticks to it & has to be lifted
Why are you so bothered by him doing this & not by Delpo's for example walking his way to serve in a slow motion to take rest between points?
Why you pick on Nadal if he says he is injured & he supports it by reporting absent in a trophy he held its title & have every reason to defend it?
Why for Rafa it's execuses while for Fedex always valid reasons even though Fedex hardly missed any major tournament for the reason of being injured?
Many of you guys are so biassed!!!
Finally I don't want Fedex to retire & I am willing to stop disliking him in case he improved his personal attitude, neverthless if he wins or lose
Don't you see the point we Rafa's fans mopst of us have no problem with Murray, Djokovic, Delpotro, Roddick, Verdasco, Tsonga, Gonzalez...etc even though they are competitors to Nadal & give him hard time many times?

the reason why some comments are missing it that we moved our hardware to a new location. We used a temporary server while moving, and some of the comments posted during this short period were lost, unfortunately.
Administrator
, 9/17/09 3:53 PM

Now I understand why a whole lot of conversation was lost on a few threads and that it was a site-wide problem.

I forgot to mention that the US Open final 2009 against Delpo was one of the best Fedex most entertaining games & probably the best long final I have watched for US open

no mention of sanctions & fines for fedclown. proof the usta is afraid of him & does whatever he tells them to do. they back this guy ahead of serena? very interesting! alls i cared about was Delpony winning VAMOSSSSSS

smartycuty-
"finally" a post from you that is reasonable,WITHOUT using any vile language.i can answer some of your questions but only subjectively (as my opinion). rafa's "personal habits" have NEVER bothered me-"smarty"-because i concentrate on his tennis skills.i think EVERYsingle person here can account for that.Rafa is a fantastic player,humble,great,a credit.i enjoy watching his game.of course.i know media magnifies and twists words to a point which distorts the true picture.some of the horrible things that antifans have said about federer are uncouth,vile,untrue,and hurtful.(you saying some of them).i cannot answer for everyone.i prefer to concentrate on games of players/skills of players and i would rather see both rafa and roger play forever-but that is impossible.its nasty to talk about a player which undermines their game by talking in such a disrspectful way.you are passionate about rafa.i understand that.but i have always been a fair poster.roger was wrong to swear-of course-but when you look at how many players swear on court, smarty, time and time again,its sickening that their names arent mentioned,roddick,murray,serena-its more of a personal attack on roger- he made a mistake-its not like he is like this every match.both roddick and murray are. always. they are passionate. Federer is a fantastic rolemodel,he is generous with his money, he spends MORE TIME-than any other player giving media interviews and spending time with fans-he does a lot of work unknown-outside of tennis-"odd days" when he should rest,to help underprivileged kids.this is not a selfish man, smarty.this is a great man.i am going to post something delpotro said about federer here-which a tennisfriend of mine sent to me-it wont change your mind,but it will make me feel better. welcome to TT smarty,but try to be fair.its the only way-and-NONE- of us are perfect,so try a bit of forgiveness.might make you feel better.

?You deserve it; you had a great tournament,? Federer told del Potro at the net.

At the subsequent victory ceremony, del Potro had to hint that he would like to thank his family and friends and Argentine supporters in Spanish, which he was eventually allowed to do. He was very sweet and very respectful toward Federer after wearing him down over 4 hours 6 minutes.

?I see Roger, he is a gentleman player, I have many things to learn from him,? del Potro said later.

In this first five-set final in a decade, Federer made 15 unforced errors in the final set to del Potro?s 4. Maybe Federer, the five-time champion, was worn down after helping care for his twins, born July 23, although Kim Clijsters had looked pretty spry during her two-week joy ride, in the company of her 18-month-old daughter.

This match was better than fans might have expected when del Potro dispatched an obviously wounded Rafael Nadal in the semifinals on Sunday ? and then apologized, sort of.

Instead of the compact and energetic Nadal on the traditionally charged Sunday afternoon, the Open got del Potro on a weekday, but he brought his Argentine fans with him, just enough people shouting soccer chants and waving the Argentine flag to give the place some energy.

The last five-setter was in 1999, when Andre Agassi won his second Open, this one over Todd Martin, whose name is not often associated with five-set final thrills.

Del Potro, who is 6 feet 6 inches tall ? five inches taller than Federer ? gave the crowd some hope in the second set when he temporarily figured out Federer?s softer game.

?With Roger, the best player in history, I have nothing to lose,? del Potro said.

By the third set, Federer was reduced to a terse exchange with the chair umpire, even dropping a rather routine expletive in the middle of it, although nothing of the Serena Williams level.

In the fourth set, Federer had to negotiate the right to make a challenge, which he won ? a rare success at challenges for him ? only to lose the set. Late in the fourth, Federer could barely get around for what should have been a routine forehand against the challenger.

?I?ve had a wonderful year and I?m still No. 1,? Federer said later, while praising del Potro.
cheers everyone.

smarty,this was the bit in particuluar:so keep things in perspective;
By the third set, Federer was reduced to a terse exchange with the chair umpire, even dropping a rather routine expletive in the middle of it, although nothing of the Serena Williams level.

smartcuty..."sir" was a joke! a bit of humour/sarcasm................?????????!!!!!!

maxi..........thanks for that........I'd like to add to that.................honestly.........what an overblown situation.................following reported in Sports Illustrated...:

Umpire Jake Garner made the somewhat unfortunate decision to allow Juan Martin del Potro to challenge the last shot of a game that Federer won.

In theory, that is Mr. del Potro's right. But if a player wants to challenge a point, the rules say he must do it immediately. Del Potro could have taken a subway to Barnes and Noble and read the first three chapters of "The Lost Symbol" in the time it took him to decide whether to challenge.

By the time he did, both players were actually off the court for the between-game break. Yet Garner accepted the challenge.

Neither Williams nor Federer will look back on their outburst with pride, surely. But Williams's outburst will surely go down as one of the epic tennis meltdowns of all time, and not just because she is a woman.

Federer's? Even amid the expletives, it was so urbane, that one sense he only left one thing off: "QED."

okay.

FFT, how are you? As an American, what has been the reaction to Serena's conduct? in your opinion?
Zoey......where are you?
Sky.........take care............
take care all federer fans......................

Trixxyfest,
You are absolutely right:
1-No punishment for Fedex smashing racket while losing from Djoko earlier this year
2-No punishment for Fedex swearing at Umpires in a very ugly way
Fedex has big conections in the Tennis Decision Makers & therefore he can do whatever without any note or warning, not punishment even
Corruption has reached everything in our life whether it is politics, economy, business, sports....etc!!!!:(:(:(

smartycuty...............i cant enter into a ridiculously biased discussion on your part about fed. i have found a brrillliannttt write up tho on the match - .......................and its about time that all this hullabaloo stopped. .......................fed was right about what happened, and if you can read the following and perhaps understand where he was coming from, then we have a fairer discussion going on - trixxyfest is hardly a fair poster here..................

Three points about this 40-second clip: (this was the clip where roger said "S**t". other players say this louder, more audible..........
to an audience on a more regular basis............so what?

1. Federer's internal clock is as precise as his tennis game: del Potro took a full 10 seconds before he decided to challenge the call.

2. The challenge system obviously needs to be overhauled. Currently, the evolution of nearly every challenge is as such: ball is ruled in or out; player leisurely strolls over to the mark to have a look; player asks chair umpire his thoughts, chair ump is indecisive (why risk being wrong?); player weighs his options, decides it's worth a challenge, 'cause hey, why let 'em go to waste? The player could use a breather anyhow.

3. Federer has always hated the challenge system. And do you know why? Because he is smarter than all of us. His thoughts from '07 when they first started using it:

"I think it's nonsense," he said. "Now they can hide even more behind these calls. We would like to be able to rely a little bit on umpires. They tend to now just let us do the work, the tough stuff. They let us get embarrassed, basically."
Correct. As it is now, the chair umpire has three jobs: Call out the score, keep track of the time on changeovers and request new balls. As much as Federer would like to see it happen, the Hawk-Eye system isn't going away. But the least chair umps could do is put their foot down on players taking too long to challenge.

How about a two second rule? One Mississippi, two Mississippi: If you haven't challenged by then, too bad. No looking at the spot, checking with the player's box or asking the ump. If you think the call's wrong, challenge. If not, that's cool too. But we have a match to play here, so let's move it along.

(Speaking of, perhaps it's time to put the clock on players taking too much time between serves as well. Do you really need to bounce the ball 37 times before you decide that it is, in fact, bouncy enough to be serviced?)

this was reported in Foxsports today.......................

"Fedex has big conections in the Tennis Decision Makers & therefore he can do whatever without any note or warning, not punishment even"

Guys ...i think we are back on the conspiracy trains ...its only a few more post before we go back to scheduling , draws and rain delays ....oh yeah ...not to forget my favorite rain dance :P

fft ...remember my comments a week ago that you called me out on ....read posts above ...do u think i should still hold my "tongue" ? nadumbo does not sound too bad does it ?

Malt ....did u make it to SW19 ?

Cheers Federites !!
C'MON!!

"Do you really need to bounce the ball 37 times before you decide that it is, in fact, bouncy enough to be serviced?"

This had me ROFL ...hahah ...

I think now since we are talking about rules ...maybe ATP need to tighen up when it comes to time wasting between points . I mean we all know who the most notorious time waster on court is . But then nothing is being done about it . Every now and the you hear time violations being called but when does ATP say enough is enough. Pushing and bending the rules as much as you can should not be accommodated ..
In fact players that actually 'get on with it' would find this ridiculously annoying . But you would not be able to vocally complaint about it since its basically an unpopular move and its now up to the umpires to straighten this out . I mean soderling and berdych are the two that I know who just couldn't take this crap on court ...and retaliated ....makes me wonder ....i think its time ATP tighten up .....or is there a conspiracy behind this ( hahah ...i just was so tempted to add the last thought .. )


C'MON !!

What gets me about Fed is that even when the replay shows the call went against him, he STILL thinks he was right! What on earth is that all about? Does Fed think he knows more than the computer? I have seen him do this a few times, simply not be prepared to accept the decision even when it has been shown conclusively to be so. That is positively bizarre! In Fed's world, everything must be as he says it is.

Nadal fans like myself have never been as disrespectful to Fed as his fans have been to Rafa. I had to leave another tennis site because of all the Rafa hate. I thought that maybe I could reason with them or find common ground, but I was wrong. Fed fans have this irrational hatred towards Rafa that seems to know no bounds. Maybe it's because Fed has a losing record to Rafa in grand slams. It's the one blotch on Fed's record.

It's not unusual to read Fed fans trashing Rafa for using injuries as an excuse, while in the next breath they say he is washed up and done due to injuries. The contradiction just kind of jumps out when you read comments by Fed fans about Rafa. It never ceases to be a source of great amusement, but I draw the line when they start saying that Rafa dropped out of Wimbledon due to fear of losing rather than injured knees. This particular absurd comment just won't go away. It keeps popping up on some tennis sites, despite all the factual evidence of Rafa's tendinitis in his quadricep tendon. Like Rafa would drop out of Wimbledon, the title he holds my dear, and do so out of fear of losing! If there is one player who has shown courage time and time again, it's Rafa. He had every reason to lose in the 2009 AO final, yet somehow he found a way to win. He could have folded after Fed came back strong to win two sets to tie it up in that historic 2008 Wimbledon final. Rafa never gives up and never backs down. But for some reason, he seems to be a thorn in the side of Fed fans.

Torres what are you talking about???
And ones more to go back to Nole...what R U speaking about...what kind of incident...NY crowd didn't like Nole respond to Roddick's bul..it...and that was incident???
Nole just told the true...without kissing a..es to noone.
As commentator on eurosport UK said, it was not wise, but it was brave and proud serbian is not afraid to say what he think. That is real honesty...not Exfed's dillusions and cheap diplomacy...
And you and your colegues are giving THAT example for Nole's atittude???
How many time Nole exepted points...u didn't saw "Challege it" comment to Roddick...it was break point for Nole...BREAK. Can you imagine your idol to do something like that??? Instead ExFed said same comment to Rafa on Wimbledon...
What would U said if Nole give statement like " U know Roger has osteo...back problems...bird flue..SARS...???"
U would be screaming and salivating all aroun' this site.

http://www.tennis.com/news/news.aspx?id=185956 - he was fined for swearing at the ump

Federer fined $1,500 for profanity at U.S. Open

NEW YORK (AP)?Roger Federer has been fined $1,500 for using a profanity while arguing with the chair umpire during the U.S. Open final.

CBS microphones picked up the exchange during its live broadcast of the match.

Tournament spokesman Chris Widmaier says Federer is being docked the same amount as two other players?Vera Zvonareva and Daniel Koellerer?for audible obscenity.

Widmaier says a total of $31,500 in fines is being collected by the tournament, topped by Serena Williams? $10,000 for unsportsmanlike conduct. She also was fined $500 for racket abuse.

Daniel Nestor was docked $5,000 for unsportsmanlike conduct toward a fan.

I wonder who will win the sportsmanship award for 2009..............Don't tell me...........Federer, like they actually count the votes.

"Federer has always hated the challenge system. And do you know why? Because he is smarter than all of us"

lol,I actually stopped reading after that.I didn't think any fan of any tennis player would make himself or herself so slave to his or her favorite player.Now,Roger has also the highest IQ in the world? lol.

sisterongt, lol

Sisterofnight,
They call this brain wash, that's if there is any brain from the beginning
LOLOLOL

Nativenewyorker , 9/17/09 9:38 PM

this post is brilliant. best one i've read on this site

particularly this bit:

It's not unusual to read Fed fans trashing Rafa for using injuries as an excuse, while in the next breath they say he is washed up and done due to injuries. The contradiction just kind of jumps out when you read comments by Fed fans about Rafa.

hit the nail on the head right there. i've read so many times that we can't say he lost due to injury, but that he'll never play again because he's so injured. which is it? it can't be both

a test to see if this post goes thru...somehow lost two attempts to post to malt!

finally, a post went thru....Malt! so happy to see you are back on TT!!!

we need more Fedfans! the numbers of anti-fed fans seems to rise by the day!

i just posted a longer post to you and for some reason it did not show up here. now out of time ( VERY busy trying to get caught up on work) must make this quick.....hope you are rested and ready to talk tennis! soooo glad you are back!!

to tell you the truth, i had come to believe that you were Maxi ( that's a compliment , maxi! )....if you are one and the same please, please morph into one....just kidding maxi...lol...

just very relieved to have you back lovely malt!! been reading bleacher report regularly ( for a more balance of perspectives ) and even signed into tennisx a couple weeks ago ( but only posted once as 'contador') love that alberto .....lol...

sad about rog losing but you know me about me and the delPO!!

hope to catch you when you are awake sometime soon!
zoe

Zoey, I lost some posts too plus a whole debate that went on between me and carrie all because I was seen as "defending fed" and another Rafa fan told me that they weren't sure what side I was on. All because I don't buy into the conspiracy theories abounding! Plus I was told that I APPROVED of Roger's swearing. You were there in that thread at the time and you know I didn't approve. I was trying to be fair and because certain Rafa fans saw it as "defending fed", then I got attacked by them and now pointed statements are out there about "genuine fans."

NativeNewYorker, some Rafa fans let their dislike of fed turn into attacking a fellow Rafa fan! I'm so disgusted right now, it's not even funny!

Hi fft! i just posted to you on the 'live match blog' and the whole thing never made it through! was agree w/ you about the commentary during the match ( we were probably watching same coverage ) and much was said about the 'coaching' delpo was getting. yeah, you were getting some peer pressue...lol...i should know you don't like swearing!! you have been amazing fair! much appreciated.

i admit my humor runs a bit irreverent and immature, fft....so i kinda find some of it laughable; but it has gone over the top!!

maybe i am being edited? in the post that did not go thru on the live blog thread i commenting if it was ' pick on torres day' cos ricky seemed to be really harsh on that thread in his responses to a couple fedfans. maybe he was joking.....hard to tell tho.

i can only speak for myself but i am thrilled that delpo got his first GS and this was one loss for Fed that i am fine with. not at all hard to get over.

as far as fed losing his temper? can you imagine the hype, the headlines, the video clips that would run over and over if Roger Federer bashed his knuckles until they bled a la muzz or pounded a thigh during changeover like nole did during the semifinal?

the price of great talent, fame and fortune, right? held under a microscope. well, going to bed early, fft. suffering from tennis withdrawal....lol..

fan4tennis,

I can understand your feelings completely. I am not one of the Rafa fans who talks about Federer conspiracies. I dislike that kind of talk. Rafa doesn't need that kind of defense. He takes the draw at every tournament and deals with it as it comes.

I have had battles on some Rafa forums when I don't go along with the general propaganda. I think for myself and don't need to go along to get along. It's a shame that Rafa fans can't stick together, because we need to do it. But I do have to say that the hatred from Fed fans for Rafa is altogether disturbing and unnerving. You would think that, given Fed's recent triumphs and success, maybe it would let up but that is not the case. I think it's even worse. That means that they fear Rafa, because if you don't care about someone and don't see them as a threat, then you would just ignore them. But that is not the case when it comes to Fed fans. They seem to think that if they keep repeating that Rafa is through, washed up, then it will become true. It's like repeating a lie so often that it becomes accepted as fact or truth.

The Fed fans can't deny this, because they expend way too much energy going after Rafa. If they truly believed their own rhetoric, then they would know they have nothing to fear from Rafa. I think they know all too well that at age 23, Rafa is far from used up and has much more to accomplish. Just the mere fact that he could have completed the grand slam with a win at this year's US Open, speaks volumes about how much he has accomplished at such a young age.

The one thing I take from the Open is that Rafa knees looked better than they have in a long time. I record as many of his matches as possible and have his movements on court practically memorized. I can spot trouble before it happens. It was a joy to see Rafa running around on the hard courts with such ease. Now if he can just get over this abdominal injury, then maybe we will see him at peak form in the 2010 AO. I love when people try to write off Rafa. I think he uses that for motivation.

syb69,

Thanks for you kind words. I have pointed this out on another tennis site, but I don't think I ever got an answer. I think it's important to point out the inherent contradictions in the rabid Fed fans and their incessant trashing of Rafa. I am glad that you could appreciate the point I was trying to make.

Maybe they just don't have an answer! You can't talk out of both sides of your mouth. But then, no one ever said that rabid Fed fans had common sense and rational thought on their side.

Ty native. I know what you mean about SOME fed fans. But the same holds true for SOME Rafa fans. Each camp has it's own share of good and bad.

I quit one supposedly Rafa forum because no matter what, they thrived on bashing fed. I asked simply, why do you have to even talk about fed when this is a Rafa site? I got attacked from all corners, but others said they agreed with me and didn't like all the bashing. They eventually created a special thread to bash fed but you still can't speak fairly in all the regular threads.

I dislike fed and that is no secret here. I decided that if I didn't want to write something bad about fed, I just wouldn't mention him. But I am so extremely disappointed in certain Rafa fans that they would dare question my faith in Rafa when all I did said was 1) that fed had a valid point in being mad about the challenge but he shouldn't have sworn and 2) that many Lexus dealers had ads about giving the car away at the USO LONG BEFORE the tourney started in response to those that insist that it was all meant for fed but Delpo screwed it up.

Native, I think there are many positives for Rafa to take from this tourney. He reached the SF and matched his result of last year. He got his Number 2 rank back. He looked so happy to be playing again! His endurance was great considering the obstacles he faced. His knees did fine. His loss in the SF was to the guy that also beat fed. That is how I choose to look at this tourney for Rafa and I'm confident that Rafa will be just fine and heal up and come back strong!

Native - great post. One of the best I have seen on this site.

maxi, you missed the point of my 1:32 PM post completely. i wasn't even thinking of this swearing when i wrote that. i'm talking about his attidude since about 2004/5!

Thank you Native for the nice post, well said man & as expected from a typical Rafa's fan who really express most of Rafa's fans opinion.

As for this incidence of Fedex angry coz of the late challenge which Delpo lost anyway...didn't Fedex himself challenged late later & won it?
Correct me if I am wrong!

Malteser,
It's very funny to read your comments about Fedex hates the challenge system since it was introduced in 2007
Sorry for the example but it makes me think: Do thieves love policemen?
I wonder how many balls did Fedex win by pro-fed umpires till they invented this computer system?
Embarrassing??? of course!!!!
LOL

Insinuating that umpires are biased does not make any sense . They are lines person , there are cameras ... the conspiracy wave now has reached new heights of accusing umpires to be biased ....whats next ....fans shouting too loud during a point creating a sonic wave that gives the ball extra side spin ?

Heck , with close line call we have seen so many players complaint whether it did or did not involve hawk eye . I have seen both Fed and Nadal get mad at line calls ....no one is exempt ... it makes no sense to argue about it ...it is especially not clear to us watching on tv ...

If you are going to accuse umpires of being biased ...then the most obvious thing to bring out will be time wasting ....that we actually can count quantify and the difference between players is so blady obvious its not even funny when you get an umpire that condones to this abuse of the rules . Now , I am im no way saying they are biased ...i think that would be a very immature thought ....they are on live TV ....and they are many other judges watching behind the scenes ...what i do think is that the level of tolerance when it comes to this is becoming appalling . If you want to talk about rules ..and fair play ...this is where we start tightening things up ...i believe if your on court demeanor does not effect your opponent ..then it should not be a problem...once you start having mind games ( intentional or unintentional ) on court with your opponent by making him wait or showboating ...then something needs to be done .....and this applies for EVERYONE .. ....

C'MON !!

fan4tennis, i find you picking on rafa fans, though true in some cases, is a bit hypocritical. When maxi asked Cheryl in one of the threads about whether players could play on other courts, I thought your response to maxi was pretty condescending and aggressive. Maxi quite clearly didn't know the rules and several factors about court speed, audience, sponsors, venue, etc., etc. and yet your answers to someone who hadn't even asked you the question was unnecessarily sarcastic (why don't Nole and Fed come play at my local tennis club). I was shocked reading your posts to maxi, so I really fail to see how you can fault some rafa fans for their behaviour when I do find some of your posts quite pointed and aggressive just because maxi is a fed fan.

Maybe they should put a stop watch on court to help the players with their timing. It's OK for us sitting at home or officials keeping time, but I don't see how the players can be expected to do this, when the time from which the 20 secs starts is so varied, depending on how long it takes for them to get the balls, for the ball kids to settle down, for the crowd to settle down etc. Are the players supposed to be counting the seconds whilst also thinking about their serve?

It so happenes that some players servis action is rapid, Rafa's isn't, probably because he is not using his natural right arm; what's the showboating, could you elaborate please, Fedexfan.

Simply because Roger's halo has slipped, some people are trying to divert the spotlight onto Rafa.

hi jean.I appreciate your support,but i am fine really.things dont last very long with me.it is better to be this way.like i said previously,i am a eacher and work with kids who are deaf/partially deaf(being partially deaf myself) which doesnt mean anything else other than I HAVE TO BE patient with people-kids especially-so really,tho at first i found fan4tennis remarks a bit aggressive,the moment has passed. i teach BSL, NOT macatan/or American version. I also lipread.

zoey.i am NOT "malty".I dont know how many more times i have to say this.so am going to ignore any further comments as i find it disrepectful that as an original poster,people compare me to someone else.icannot help that.but i see "malty" is back and i am pleased for all of you who have missed him so much.malty.pleased to see dialogue from you and will respond when have more time-
TT for me is great medium in terms of conversation.i just wish that rafa fans would be more gracious with their commnents. i saw federer was fined and imo,rightly so.as murray should have been (who wasnt fined, by the way),i am sick of his swearing,every time i watch a match.with roger-he is a beautiful player,he made a mistake this time round-he has paid for it.lighten up rafafans and stop the aggression.its unpleasant.
smartycuty,you will see roger has been fined now, carrie too,so stop your sniggering remarks because its hateful.

Further to my post on timekeeping, what they should have is a bicg clock at both ends of the court so everyone can see when the 20 secs is over.

maxi, I have avoided getting into any dialogue with you over my attitude towards Roger, because I find that you are far from objective in your condemnation of some of us. The only objectivity you like is for people to sing Rogers' praises. Why don't you complain about the totally unpleasant posts from the likes of torres regarding Rafa. You are not as neutral as you think you are.

You seem to be too emotionally involved in your feelings about Roger as a tennis player. Relax, you are only a fan, Roger like Rafa and all the other players have millions of fans, we can't all see what you see to admire in Roger, similarly others can't see what Rafans admire in him, and we are all free to agree or disagree, and express our opinions without being constantly rebuked by you.

You know what, they say the biggest rivalry in sport at the moment are Roger Federer and Rafa Nadal, so that is truly manifested in their fans. We are on opposite sides of the fence, or court as it were. Relax.

VAMOS RAFA!

"...but i see "malty" is back and i am pleased for all of you who have missed him so much.malty.pleased to see dialogue from you and will respond when have more time-"-maxi

this i have to see.but isn't it that when one is talking to herself, it is a monologue and not a dialogue? :-)

"Native - great post. One of the best I have seen on this site."

Wow, Ricky. If that's one of the best, then that doesn't say much for the rest of the Web site.

... And now back to the Fed and Fedfans bashing already in progress.

Oops, I'm sorry. Nadal fans NEVER gang up on Fedfans; that's something only Fedfans do. (Apparently the previous 500 or so posts on this site mocking Federer and his fans over his Open finals meltdown are figments of my imagination.)

Maxi,
If my remarks are hateful in a matter related to the subject & to Fedex attitude, so how can you describe Torres' remarks for example when he gets Rafa involved without any reason in every single discussion to explode tons of BS hatred on a guy his only crime is: HE TOUCHED ALMIGHTY GOD OF TENNIS CROWN & STOPPED HIM FROM WINNING MORE GRAND SLAMS?????????
!!!!!!!!!!!!

jean, I have no problem with your opinion of that incident with maxi. For someone who said she had followed tennis (on tennis.x) I would've thought she would've known that especially in a Grand Slam, they don't shovel top players to just any other court available in the city it's done in. It wasn't done at Wimby when it rained for, what, 6 days, which was certainly worse than this one.


Obviously, you didn't read this part of my post:
"I dislike fed and that is no secret here. I decided that if I didn't want to write something bad about fed, I just wouldn't mention him. But I am so extremely disappointed in certain Rafa fans that they would dare question my faith in Rafa when all I did said was 1) that fed had a valid point in being mad about the challenge but he shouldn't have sworn and 2) that many Lexus dealers had ads about giving the car away at the USO LONG BEFORE the tourney started in response to those that insist that it was all meant for fed but Delpo screwed it up."
fan4tennis 9/18/09 5:29 AM

Calling for fairness and stating facts about the car is considered hypocritical? There were only 2 Rafa fans involved in that discussion. I got bashed by fellow Rafa fans for what they saw as 'defending fed'. They questioned my faith in Rafa, though one of them, got nasty when I questioned her on her constant comment throughout the tourney that fed was going to win it anyway so why didn't they just give the trophy to him already. I was told "I don't know what side you're on anymore" and that I was earning "brownie points" from the fed fans and "why are you defending fed.I thought you were a Rafa fan?" All because I dared to speak about fairness and state facts. Am I the hypocritical one here???

I stated "Ty native. I know what you mean about SOME fed fans. But the same holds true for SOME Rafa fans. Each camp has it's own share of good and bad." That is the truth and no one can deny it!

I read your post the first time. I'm not concerned about the car. Sure there are Rafa fans who are passionately biased, just like Fed fans and so on. I'm NOT denying that. My point is that having read a number of your posts, I find quite a few of them agressive and condesceding, yet you complain YOU are the one being bashed. More like subtle bullying to me. There is a variety of opinions here. You just need to be aware of that and the fact that many aren't going to budge, and move on from there. You've been going on and on about Rafa fans bashing you. I wonder if you are refering to an incident on vb where someone sometime ago complained in the "players you don't like tread" about Fed being bashed. I wondererd what on earth that person was doing in a thread like that when they were so against it!! Baffling!!

I don't see you arguing in the discussions for fairness or defending the tourney as being hypocritical. I see your finger pointing as hypocritical when you yourself sometimes do the bashing. Do you get it now? I read your posts above. TBH, it sounds like whining to me. Now I'm moving on, am rather tired of this rubbish. If you feel victimised, maybe it's time to take a break from the forum. In sports, you are always going to get passionate fans. Just remember that what you think of others, they probably think the same of you.

" I wonder if you are refering to an incident on vb where someone sometime ago complained in the "players you don't like tread" about Fed being bashed."

You got the site correct at least. What I had said, and I was not the only one, was in a general thread . There was so much complaining about all the talk of fed that they created a special "fed venting" thread because NOT ALL agreed with the fed bashing. I NEVER visited that thread.

"I see your finger pointing as hypocritical when you yourself sometimes do the bashing." Same goes to you!

carrie,

'maxi, I have avoided getting into any dialogue with you over my attitude towards Roger, because I find that you are far from objective in your condemnation of some of us. The only objectivity you like is for people to sing Rogers' praises. Why don't you complain about the totally unpleasant posts from the likes of torres regarding Rafa. You are not as neutral as you think you are.

You seem to be too emotionally involved in your feelings about Roger as a tennis player. Relax, you are only a fan, Roger like Rafa and all the other players have millions of fans, we can't all see what you see to admire in Roger, similarly others can't see what Rafans admire in him, and we are all free to agree or disagree, and express our opinions without being constantly rebuked by you.

You know what, they say the biggest rivalry in sport at the moment are Roger Federer and Rafa Nadal, so that is truly manifested in their fans. We are on opposite sides of the fence, or court as it were. Relax.

VAMOS RAFA!

carrie , 9/18/09 12:47 PM'

I dont condemn anyone carrie. NOONE. you have just 'turned' and become nasty in your comments. vindictive,unkind,horrible really.i suppose i expected more (wrong of me). i am sad about that,because when i joined, you paid me a lovely compliment, which i kept-and will keep-i have been nothing but objective about roger and rafa and am not going to regurgitate everything to please you.you are a lady who lunches-(your words), perhaps you are now getting indigestion carrie-and have nothing better to do.so relax yourself lady.and dont tell me that i am not as neutral as i think - I am completely objective in my views (i have a bit of a smile/humour-it helps me to relax),you-on the otherhand- are too uptight right now,it is impossible to havea decent dialogue with you-your loss.
fan4tennis and jean-dont fall out over me.fan4tennis-please dont assume that because tennis.x is a forum visited by me regularly, that i know everything about tennis.i dont. i merely made a very innocent comment, as i wanted to see both players play with no further delay. you have a very judgmental way about your posts/thats up to you.but just move on from it.cos these comments are just repetitive and boring-when i used to like some of the things you said-your way too aggressive for me-
jean-dont worry.am tired by all this stupid arguing over nothing-but thanks anyway:)

fan4tennis,

I have a feeling that I know which Rafa forum you are referencing. I won't reveal it publicly, but if it's the one I am thinking of, then I can say that I have had the exact same experience that you have. That is what I meant when I said that I do not subscribe to these absurd conspiracy theories involving Fed. I didn't go along with the crowd there, complaining and carping endlessly like whiners. Needless to say, my comments were not appreciated. But true Rafa fans will understand where I am coming from. We don't do Rafa any favors by wasting valuable energy complaining over the draw, fate, destiny, imaginary conspiracies or the like. Doing that doesn't indicate a lot of faith in Rafa. Time and time again, Rafa has demostrated that he can surmount any obstacle that has been placed in his path.

You have my sympathies and will find that I completely understand where you are coming from.

Senor Plaid,

Before you open up your big mouth and insult what I write, make sure you have something articulate, literate and worth reading. Gratuituously trashing what other people say doesn't cut it in my book. If you are just here to go after all Rafa fans, then I will give you fair warning. I don't put up with cheap shots and insults and have no trouble calling out people who indulge in that kind of self-indulgent garbage. Make an argument and an intelligent point or you will risk looking even more foolish than you already look.

TY native! I am sure you know exactly what I was referencing too. I had made a comment here (was lost during the hardware move according to the admin here) that I wondered if I had been talking about Roddick or Delpo, if any of it would've been an issue. It makes you wonder!

maxi, as far as I was concerned, that issue was over between us. Jean brought it back up. I apologize if I thought you knew more about tennis than you did. My comment about the Nole-fed match was to see if you'd agree to switch their match to an unknown court also to make things even. As you can read from me and native's posts, I am not into fed bashing, otherwise I would've stayed with that site. I have always said if I saw something that I thought was unfair, I would speak up regardless of who it is about.

Nativenewyorker: applauding and cheering the first paragraph of your latest post, thank-you and great to read you!

i liked the first post of yours....thinking it was during or after Delpo's win, one of those threads. anyway, did not have my wits to comment specifically ...lol.. i had just witnessed my fave going down to another fave.

yup, conspiracy theories are nonsense and useless.

yours is a much needed (imo ) voice of reason!

This whole thing is being blown out of proportion.

a) Fed did not insult anybody
b) Fed did congratulate Delpo afterwards
c) Fed did not threaten anybody

At most, Fed was just frustrated and he used the F-word. I don't see a whole lot deal. Sportsmanship is about fairness of play.

If Rafa is really the best sportman, he needs to stop the grunts and not over-celebrate his points and also not abuse the time between points rule.

This is definitely not the most fair person would do. If you are going to win, win by tennis skills, guts or whateva but no need to psyche the opponent with loud grunts and slowing the time making the other player annoyed and having to be patient waiting for his slow pace.

torres, you just can't post anything without an insult to Rafa included, can you? You are truly a broken record!

hahaha. Leave it to torres to attempt to divert the issue by bringing Rafa into the fray. Nice try, though. Your man will now start losing more than winning, and will be revealed as the person that he is, sans the halo.

torres9,

I'm not about to let you get away with those comments about Rafa.

First, Federer's cursing at the chair umpire is HIS issue. Let's make him responsible for his own actions. Bringing up Rafa's mannerisms on court has precisely nothing to do with what Fed did in that match. It's not a good analogy and not a strong argument for your guy. So let us deal with them as the separate issues that they really are.

Regarding Fed's behavior, I believe that he has been fined for on court obscenities. I think that is entirely fair. I am willing to take your comment about Fed being frustrated at face value. Let's say he was frustrated and just let his emotions get the better of him. I think one reason you get some flack about Fed's conduct in this instance, is that this is not the first time he has lost his temper when he lost control of a match. It makes him look like a poor sport and a sore loser. The minute things don't go his way, he loses his composure. A truly great champion, which Federer and his fans never let us forget he is, knows how to deal with both victory and defeat. A great champion deals with a match that is starting to get away from him and does it without resorting to gratuitous insults at the chair umpire. In other words, as long as things are going Fed's way, then he is happy and cheerful and behaves appropriately.

If we used your standard of conduct for Rafa, then I would have expected to see Rafa smash his racket and spew out a stream of profanity at the chair umpire in the final of the 2009 AO. This was a man who had everything going against him. He had only one day's rest to Federer's two, he had just finished a brutally physical five set match that left him totally beat up, he had never won a hard court grand slam and he was playing on his weakest surface. But in fact, all Rafa did was call the trainer to massage the quadricep muscle in his right leg, not even taking an injury time out. He kept his composure all through the match and managed to prevail. It was an extraordinary feat.

If all you can come up with as examples of poor sportsmanship for Rafa are his grunts, I am afraid you will have to do a lot better. Rafa is hardly the only male tennis player who grunts when he plays. We heard grunting in the Open fina with Fed and Del Potro. I think you are reaching here.

Now on to the so-called over celebrating of his points. You mean the way Monfils celebrated his winners in his fourth round match with Rafa? You know, when he was turning to the crowd and waving his arms to get them to cheer for him. Remember? Tsonga and Gonzales are also showman who have been known to play their own on court games. Actually, I think Monfils got Rafa fired up with all of his shameless playing to the crowd. He did get a warning from the chair umpire for trying to get the crowd going between points. Not Rafa. Rafa's fist pump does not in any way delay the game. It isn't about playing to the crowd, it's about pumping himself up and giving good body language. It gets his adrenaline going.

Now on to one of the most often cited issues with Rafa's game - the time he takes when he serves. I believe that he has been called for a time violation more than once. When and how the chair umpire chooses to enforce this appears to be fairly arbitrary. However, Rafa is certainly not the only player who takes some extra time when he serves. I actually don't have a problem with this and unless they intend to enforce it regularly, then Rafa should not be singled out.

Tennis should not be confused with beat the clock. Can you imagine having a stop watch or bell ringing when the number of alloted seconds are up? That is ridiculous! I like to see tennis played at a normal pace, neither too slow nor too fast. I think it's reasonable to let the players serve in their own way. If one player has a problem with it, then they can bring it up with the chair umpire. I don't see it as an advantage one way or the other. Also, it's normal to see many players take extra time when they serve at crucial points in the match. As they should. Maybe if Serena had done that, she wouldn't have been called for a foot fault. Much better to take a few more seconds to concentrate and get it right.

One can make the argument that some players take advantage by serving too quickly to put their opponent off balance. It works both ways. As long as the officials are not enforcing the time uniformly, I think it's a non issue. But then, there are always those who dislike Rafa and have to reach to find something. His behavior is so exemplary, no matter how difficult the circumstances, that one has to reach to find a true example of poor sportsmanship.

Well, then explain to me why Rafa never won it?

Conspiracy?

phoenix, starting to lose more than winning? That will only happen if Fed is stopped from using a racket playing tennis.

Even in USO he won 6 matches and lost 1 match. Still better than 124 other contestant.

126. Sorry.

Nativenewyorker, even if 200 more people grunt like Rafa it is still not the best sportman thing to do.

Saying that Rafa's time delaying is a non-issue is delusional because so many players dislike it like Soderling. And ususally they serve when the receiver has signaled that he's ready.

His behaviour off-court is exemplary but not the best. You can still hear him saying, 'it's not that he play unbelievable but more I dont play good'. That is not 100% graceful in my opinion. And being friendly is also exemplary. Fed has been the one being more friendly and gives interviewers more insights.

Nadal never complained when things are not going his way is just not true. I can show you a vid showing Rafa complaining.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ak8GRRFBN54

Go watch your 'saint Rafa' not complaining.

LOL..... IT is only natural to be frustrated.

isn't there already a time limit for the server? but its up to the ump to enforce the rule?

Owhh come on, how many times Rafa got the time-violation warning but never got a point penalty. He breaks it too much, he probably would lose 2,3 games just by penalty-points.

And also we are not talking about the rules here more than we talk about fairplay.

If you are gonna play fair, there's really no need to slow time that much. Grunts are also not against the rules but whne Nadal hits the ball he grunts at the exact time as the ball makes the sound.

I am not saying Rafa is cheating but it definitely not the best sporting behavior on-court.

the time should also be enforced for taking too long to decide to decide to challenge a lines call.

and the no coaching rule? why is that one not enforced?

tennis is a game, a test of mental abilities as well as physical.

and that was what fed was getting tee'd off about with delpo, the coaching. why should fed help delpo when clearly delpo's coach was there?

maybe there should be a buzzer go off, like the shot clock in basketball..lol...and if a server gets buzzed, they took too much time. end of story.

love-15...

torres9,

Do not use words like "delusional" if you expect to converse with me. That is not an excuse for a rational and well-informed answer.

Soderling is not worth even commenting about here. His reputation is well known. In fact, I do recall a link to a tournament in Italy in which he was playing Rafa and disputed a call, interrupting play for a long time. Rafa just stood there while Soderling ranted and raved like a lunatic. Slowing down the game? This guy stopped the match! If you have to rely on the likes of Soderling to make your argument, you have more problems than I do.

You are saying Rafa cheats, so don't back and try to deny it. The grunting is not an issue. If you think Rafa times it just when the ball hits, then I think you are having a problem with reality.

You didn't address the main points in my reply, so you aren't interested in a serious discussion. You are just here to trash Rafa. The idea that Rafa needs artificial advantages to win, would be laughable if it wasn't so insulting. Remember, this is the guy who has a winning record against Fed. Or are you now going to tell us that it's all due to his "grunting" and taking too much time to serve? Come on, now. If you are a true Fed fan, then you must admit that nothing on this earth could possibly derail the great man himself!

Wait, don't tell me - Fed lost that 2008 Wimbledon final because of the dark, right? No wait, Fed lost those RG grand slams because Rafa was playing too slow on those clay courts and grunting too much! Wait, Fed lost that 2009 AO because Rafa had an unfair advantage with only one day's rest to his two, surviving a physically demanding semifinal five setter with Verdasco while Fed had a relatively easy semifinal with Roddick, and Rafa was playing on his worst surface while Fed was playing on his best! Right?

i am interested but clearly you want to fight with torres- not have a civil discussion about the topic, which is why fed lost his temper in the match w/ delpo

bit of a contradiction there Nnykr.

lolol fedclown gets docked 1500 simoleans!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! how do all them fool fedmug clownbois justify this one?!!!!!!

LOL... Nativenewyorker, you are trying to tell me what to post or not talk with you? Are you the umpire or somethin?

You are wayy off topis which means you are basically delusional if not simply have poor logic.

Even if Rafa does grunt and slow time, he is not penalized. So he is not a cheat because the rule doesn't punish him anyway.

I am going to bring up past-glories of Fed (which is double Nadal has anyways) here. Do you have proof that Fed blamed the lights?

We are talking about sportsmanship. The grunts and time-slowing is not the best sporting thing to do especially for the opponent. It disrespects the opponent.

Even though Soderling stopped a match (whateva), if you watch the Youtube video on WImby2007, Soderling went to change his racket and Nadal was annoyed Soderling wasn't there went he was going to serve, and Soderling waved his hand saying, 'sorry'.

What did Nadal do?

He sarcastically tried to serve and then stopped and said 'new balls' to Soderling and that's when Soderling teased him.

And then afterwards, Soderling said,'I wait for him the whole match and he can't wait for me 10 seconds'.

Totally spot on.

Whateva bad manners Soderling, you can understand why the guy is annoyed with Rafa's time slowing.

if you have the right to blast Fed for merely saying F-words which is not directed to other players anyway and also complaining to the umpire is what everyone did. DID U WATCH THE VIDEO LINK??

NO. I GUESS. YOU JUST CAN'T ACCEPT RAFA CAN COMPLAIN TOO.

Owhh, and I am sure fellow tennis players do not vote Fed for Best SPortsmanship 5 times not to mention Fed won Prix Orange 5 times for nothing.

FIVE Sportsmanship awards? And this is something you can be proud of? You can break your racket, you can curse at the umpire, you can throw water bottles around in a fit of anger, you don't shake hands with your opponent when you lose...You can do all that and still when the sportsmanship awards. After all, you ARE Roger Federer.

zoey,

I don't want to fight with anyone, but I don't back down just because a Fed hater wants to trash Rafa. It's that simple. People always say that a person is delusional when they can't refute their argument.

torres9,

You are really too funny! Didn't you realize that I was being sardonic when I said that Fed lost because of the dark? It was meant to be witty! My goodness, but who really wants to fight with who here? You made me laugh, though, and that's a good thing.

You and I are never going to agree and that's really all there is to it. Who said I was blasting Fed anyway? Are you actually reading what I am saying or confusing me with someone else? I am defending Rafa against your absurd and inaccurate attacks. You have not once addressed the points I made in my original post.

Why do you need to hate on Rafa? How is he a threat to you or your hero Fed? How am I trashing Fed? Much of my post was meant in jest and humor, yet you are the one who is taking it so much to heart! Take a break! Chill out for heaven's sake! We are not discussing world peace here.

By the way, let me correct you and state that I never said Rafa was a saint. That was your comment, not mine. So don't put words in my mouth. Rafa is human. No, I didn't watch the video. Why do I need to do that? I am not afraid to see Rafa get upset. You are the one who has gotten way too carried away with this discussion. Now I am getting bored and have no wish to continue with someone who is so thin-skinned that they have to freak out as though I am saying terrible things to Fed. You are just looking for an argument. I choose not to do it, because with you it's a tremendous waste of time. I came on here to have lively, reasonably intelligent discussions. I will do so with those who can converse in a more amiable manner than you.

zoey,

I must say that I am a little disappointed in your comment about me want to fight with torres9. I have been reading this person's posts on another topic and it's the same old stuff. This is the kind of rabid Fed fan who is just looking to pick a fight with anyone.

I think I have addressed the topic of this discussion in my previous posts. Fed did lose his temper and use profanity to the chair umpire. Would you like me to repeat my thoughts on that again? I have no problem sticking to the topic, but this particular Fed fan keeps wanting to make it about Rafa. I don't even see why Rafa should be a part of this discussion. He isn't the one who did the cursing. Yet once again Rafa is artificially inserted into the discussion by a disgruntled Fed fan who refuses to even admit that his hero's conduct is wrong. Then he makes these ad hominem arguments to me and the whole discussion deteriorates from there.

I tried to use a little wit and humor in my post to try to lighten things up, but that didn't stop this person from attacking me again. He continues to go on and on about some link he found that supposedly shows Rafa getting mad. So what on earth does that have to do with Fed's actions? This is the problem I have with people like that. They are incapable of simply dealing with Fed's actions and not lumping in another player's actions. Why is that I ask? Why must Rafa always be injected into something that is about Fed?

Please do not hold me responsible for someone twisting this discussion into being all about Rafa grunting and serving too slow and getting mad. I didn't change the topic of discussion. That is why I will refuse to engage this person any further. I suggest you go on the topic which is about Fed being fined and read this same person's posts. It's the same angry ranting over and over again.

LOL NNY, I am the one posting here.

So I am the 'rabid' Fed fan?
Then how bout you?

A rabid Nadal fan?

WHy didn't you wanna watch the video? Are you scared to face the hard facts? That Nadal is not as Mother Thresa as you think he is?

This the denial that Rafans live in. We Fed fans accept Fed as a human being. We are well aware that he has been throwing rackets since he was in his juniors.

So he throws 1 racket in 5 years. BIG BIG BIG DEAL...
How bout you all Rafans form a church choir and sing I'M A BIG BIG GIRL IN THIS BIG BIG WORLD MAKING BIG BIG DEAL OUT OF NORMAL THINGS

I dont see why I should talk about your topics, when you are the one replying to my post in the 1st place.

Really, I think you're too old for this.

"We Fed fans accept Fed as a human being."

it's people like you who put him on a pedestal above the havens and fanatically lash out an anyone who dares pick on ONE thing (out of the million good things he's done) and you HAVE accepted he is human? torres, are schizpphrenic or just in plain denial?

Time and time again, Rafa has demostrated that he can surmount any obstacle that has been placed in his path.

Nativenewyorker , 9/18/09 11:41 PM


So obstacles are put in Rafa's way then.

Native, I wouldn't take everyone who say they are Rafans at face value, when they slag Rafa off in defence of Federer just to get in with Fedfans. Unfortunately, those posts were lost due to technical problems, but some of the so called fans of Rafa are ready to sell him down the river just to get brownie points.

I won't take anything this person says anymore at face value.

I am not going to present myself as mother Theresa, because I know I am one of the most vocal opponents of Federer, which obviously some people even Rafans don't like, but I am always who I am, I don't pretend to be anything else. Some of the vicious attacks on Rafa need to be refuted though, and I just can't stand the arrogance of some Fedfans.

Homos, do you really have any good points? Are you able to think? Clearly you don't. All you can say if I say A is that you say,' No it's not B?' If I ask you'why is it B?', you don't know how to answer. Go take a degree in 'Fundamentals of thinking 101' and then I'll reply to your posts.

carrie, if you could just leave a Fed thread alone and not put any snide remarks about him, then maybe you are qualified to accuse other people arrogant or whateva.

But you post hate posts of Fed even more than Rafa's support posts sometimes. If you don't want people to attack Rafa, then why don't you try quitting dissing the Fed.

homos,

Thank you for taking up the cause. Since I am "too old" for this, I leave it to you to try and reason with this person. Good luck, because you are going to need it. I wonder how anyone can possibly know if I am too old for anything. That was a strange comment.

Thanks for the last line in your comment. I think you have it just about right. It's too bad, because it's nice to come here and just have a respectful, lively discussion and even disagree about different issues.

But the thing that troubles me is how Rafa is always, always brought into the conversation, even when it's not about him. This is supposed to be about Fed and his tirade in the final. Why on earth do I have to start defending Rafa? I even watched that stupid link that was posted and, I have to tell you, it was truly laughable. It was from a 2007 match and Rafa questioned a call and the hawkeye showed it was just barely in by the barest little tiny amount. So Rafa got upset and went to his seat and seemed to be yelling, but he didn't look at the umpire and you couldn't hear what he was saying. Then he seemed to put his racket down hard. So I ask you, what in the world is the point of that link? Supposedly to show that Rafa isn't a "saint". If anyone can find where I called Rafa a saint, please let me know. Rafa can lose his cool and that's fine. If he shouts an obscenity, then he should be fined. But for the last time, this topic is about Fed.

I am disgusted with how this has degenerated into name calling. That's what people like torres9 do all the time. Then I get accused of wanting to fight with this person. Who can possibly argue with someone who is irrational. I kind of feel sorry for people like that. It must be hard to put someone like Fed on such a big pedestal, like he is a God, and then have to defend him when he shows everyone that in the end he is merely a man.

This guy is absolutely sick & lunatic
Mental hospitals need guys like that but there is no cure
He knows himself very well
His deseases are INFINTY

smartcuty,

Are you talking about torres or the fed? :-)

carrie,

I am not sure if I understood your response directed at me. Do I understand that now you have a problem with something I said or did you not understand what I was saying? I am confused by your response.

Let me try to clarify my comments. When I said that Rafa has surmounted every obstacle, I was referring to times like at the 2009 AO final, where he only had one day's rest and was physically beaten up after that tough semifinal with Verdasco. He was playing on his weakest surface where he had never won, yet he manage to triumph over those obstacles and win. That was my point.

If this has something to do with my comment about not going along with the conspiracy theories about Fed trying to ruin Rafa's chances to win, well, I stand by that comment. I do not believe in conspiracy theories. That doesn't mean that I like Fed or am in any way a fan. So I am not sure why you have a problem with what I wrote.

If we are both Rafa fans, I can't see where we have any disagreement. We are on the same side. If you disagree with me about the conspiracy theories that say Fed will make Rafa lose, then yes we must agree to disagree. I believe in Rafa. I have faith in him. I know that he can win out over anything. It can be a bad draw, rain delays, even physical pain.

If you wish to explain why you have an issue with my comments, I would appreciate it very much.

oh no no no nativenewyorker you are not dumping this person on me. i am not taking up any cause. rafa is no saint and neither am i!! :P

carrie, are you ok? don't worry too much about it, a lot are outside our control.

i was trying to find where this thread's discussion diverted but am giving up.

aying that Rafa's time delaying is a non-issue is delusional because so many players dislike it like Soderling. And ususally they serve when the receiver has signaled that he's read.

torres9 , 9/19/09 4:22 AM

So torres, how long does the receiver have to be ready...............20secs, 10secs or what. If the receiver is not ready for 25 seconds, is that then the fault of the server. I don't know where you are coming from.

Phoenix,
I only talk about one & you got it right

Native, when you said Rafa surmounts all obstacles, I was pointing out that there must then be something in the conspiracy theories. I think there are, not necessarily against Rafa, but generally in favour of Federer; but you don't so we'll disagree on that. Other than that, I agree with your views wholeheartedly.

I was also pointing out that someone here, who says she's a Rafan, and is now echoing everything you say, attacked me for asking if Federer had been fined for his language at the USO, saying that after all Rafa swears as well, because a spanish friend of hers had told her that Rafa swears in spanish. She was dissing Rafa, with something she couldn't substantiate, just to get in with Fedfans. With friends like these. You would never ever hear a Fedfan diss Federer to protect Rafa.

Unfortunately all this happened during the time when some posts were lost. I couldn't believe what this person was saying.

Owhh Native, you feel sorry for me. Well, I feel sorry for you for having a weak logic

So Rafa had no on-court microphone when he complained like Fed did. That's the only DIFFERENCE. You are berating the Fed for complaining and using the F-word whateva. It is just frustration. No harm is done on anyone by both.

At least you agreed that Rafa is on the same grounds with Fed.

To me, Rafa or Djoker or Delpo or Muzza are not better sportmen than Fed. Maybe they are more quiet or more reserved. But not better sportmen.

Fed gets all the bad rep because he is under microscopic observation by people who pick on his occasional frustrations.

You can say whateva personal attacks you can say on me. For me, it just you guys can't really debate properly. ALl you can do is talk bad about me. Be my guestss

If the master is a BIG AH so what do you expect from a stupid slave?
LOL

Another evidence that smartcuty isn't smart at all LOL

another evidence that torres9 isn't sanz at all. poor spaniard :P

torres, you still haven't answered my question -how long does the receiver have to say he is ready?

Another evidence that homos is just a loser after all. poor guy :P

wow, i'm impressed. you've got all the bases covered. all by your lonesome.you really must get a life, torres. :-)

oh wait you haven't answered carrie's question.

phoenix, :) ROFL

torres, you must be proud of yourself. in your masters thesis, do you put forward your arguements by launching personal attacks on your potential markers??

smartcuty, they really are very strict about the use of certain language here, even when abbreviated, I mention it because I would hate to lose you on this forum.

VAMOS RAFA!

carrie, why should I answer your questions? You never answered mine. Go find out yourself.

Phoenix, go to the psychiatrist fast. You are imagining that you know me in real life... LOL...

I don't usually post here, only on Tennis.X, but due to the nice mix of comments I've read thus far (too many to read though) and the free expression of opinions, I'd like to add my two bits worth on the topic.

With respect to Fed's tirade, I'm not one for being offended by players' rants, especially towards umpires, who I feel are pretty inept at doing their jobs. However, it does show that Federer is human and can behave as poorly just like the other players, thus he should NOT be placed on a pedestal as being the epitome of graciousness, et al.

I know Maxi references Tennis.X often on this blog, and I can understand why, because Tennis.X is an extremely pro-Federer site, and Maxi being a Fed fan, would naturally love it there, as no one is allowed to write comments that are anti-Federer, even if it's the gospel truth. Further, it should be pointed out that anyone who's not a Fed fan{atic}, and dares to remark on anything that's perceived to be remotely anti-Federer by his fans, that person would be eternally targeted (with the worst kind of vocabulary one can think of and name calling) castigated, harassed, literally placed in the dog house, shunned and be given a bad reputation as a 'Federer hater' perpetually. Once this reputation is gotten, it's not an easy one to remedy. To survive on Tennis.X, a non-Federer poster has to learn to agree with the Fed fans, and play a game (which I'm not good at doing and there are a few posters who are like that) as being fair and wonderful, pleasant, etc., keep their mouths shut and overlook everything, or lavish praise on Federer, even if they're not sincerely meant, or else WWIII would break loose and a verbal lynching would occur. Needless to say, nothing written by a Federer fan is moderated and is allowed, but the same does not happen if it's the opposite, and verbal attacks by a Fed fan are permissible, but when it's the opposite the comments are removed or the poster is chided. Presently, on Tennis.X, very few posters are posting, because if the Fed posters are not celebrating his wins they find it difficult to post, as talking tennis to them is all about Federer's winning way and his stats. Hence, all's at a standstill.

I 'd like to say I commend TennisTalk for allowing diversity of opinions, and also keeping the comments moderately peaceful. Tennis.X should take a page out of your book and disallow the nastiness that's posted by the Federer fans, who I feel own the site.

Maxi, I know you've gone over to Tennis.X and preached to me about your peaceful attitude whereby you don't like arguments and openly blamed me for not posting there due to wanting 'peace', which is not true because you've continued to post there all of the time. Yet here I see you as a verbal warrior and one who's doing the exact opposite of what she's preached. You know what Maxi, as I mentioned a week ago, it's easy to proclaim oneself as 'peaceful' , righteous and noble, when they are on the outside looking in and all's peaceful and wonderful in Fed land, but when faced with conflict and you see your fave being ridiculed, it's not that easy to not become offended and fight verbal wars, is it ? In sum, Maxi, you are no better than those you ridicule, and are even worse, because you set yourself up as some kind of saint, at the expense of another's reputation. Way to go Maxi, and keep up with the 'noble' attitude, it will take you far, and has been shown here, you're not as great as you think you are, because you can't handle one-tenth of what you dish out and/or preach.

Maxi, if you feel the nedd to respond to me, please do me a favour, do so on this site and on this thread, and NOT like the last time, where you posted your reply on Tennis.X. Thank you.
***************
memi: I'm happy to see you've found a nice partial place to air your views, good for you! However, I'd like to point out that Lexus gives a car each year to the winner of the USO, so it does not necessarily mean that they did it for Federer, but just for the winner.

I know much has been made of DelPotro's rise, but I see it as someone who got lucky in an easy draw. Inasmuch as many don't like to admit it, the draw makes all the difference in a tournament. it's not easy for a plyer to beat many tough opponen ts and get to a final. In DelPotro's match vs. Nadal, i think nadal's injury, plus fighting off very tough opponents, made DP's win look like a sound beating of Nadal, but I don't agree, we should look at the circumstances surrounding the win. If, in the future, DelPotro can again beat Nadal as convincingly, considering Nadal beat him at IW 6-2, and 6-3 earlier this year, then I'll be convinced that Del,Potro has Nadal's number.

Also, I think to be fair to Federer, he played the second semi match and I'm thinking he had to be tired, as he mentioned in his presser, due to less amount of recovery time, which could be the difference in that match. I know Federer made some crucial mistakes, especially going to the drop shots a lot, but to me that's another manifestation of his tiredness, because when a player is tired, he wants to ends the points as quickly as possible especially using drop shots, and his thinking is also not as sharp as when he's NOT tired. Hence, I think DelPotro was able to sense that something was amiss in Federer's game and was able to exploit that, and as a result he won the match. The 5th set was another manifestation of Federer's tiredness. I think the next time the two meet would give us a better understanding of where they both stand and how they match up against each other. I think Federer underestimated DP's fitness and will be prepared to take it to him when they next meet.

I also think the same should be applied to Nadal and DelPotro. If and when the two should meet, and Nadal is 100 percent fit, it should give us an indication as to how the two match up against each other. Im hoping Nadal would win that encounter.

Well, I see there have been numerous posts since I was last here. I hardly know where to begin.

carrie,

I do understand where you are coming from. What is important is that we are both fans of Rafa. That gives us precious common ground. I am happy that you seem to understand where I am coming from as well.

homos,

I can certainly understand why you wouldn't want to be stuck with the responsibility of replying to the posts from torres9. It is a herculean task, especially when this person continues to distort, twist and misinterpret what others write. This is a person who needs to live in their own little world, where there is no disagreement and no discussion. That cannot be tolerated, because then it would mean that others have rights, too.

torres9,

You are stepping way up in class with me and I would be really careful. You may end up getting really embarrassed, but I doubt you would admit it. Do not ever, ever dare to speak for me! I never said that Fed and Rafa are on an equal level. This is precisely the point I was trying to make. You are innately dishonest, because you take comments and give your own interpretation.

That link you posted was pathetic and didn't show anything nearly as bad with Rafa as with Roger. Sorry to disillusion you, but there is no comparison, except in your poor deluded mind.

You really should seek professional help, instead of coming on here to disrupt our discussion. Reading your posts, all I see is an angry, desperate, unfortunate person who is taking out their own problems on the people who come here to share their ideas and opinions. There is a lot of help out there for you. Please get some and fast.

Haha, Nativenewyorker just cracked... You were giving me countering points but your last post was all about personal attack to me.

I have been here longer than you so dont come here and act like you own this website.

Seek Help. Call 1800-62626262626262 for Dr.Delpo

Torres,

allow me to give you another piece of friendly advice. If you want to trash talk Nadal fans, find something else other than reminding them that Del Potro beat Nadal.

Because in case you forgot, Del Potro beat Federer the very next day. And, if you really want to go in depth into the matches, Federer gave up. Nadal at least fought until the final point.

torres9,

You are the one who acts like you own and control this website. The rest of us are just trying to deal with you.

You cracked up a long time ago. But what is so sad for you, is that you have to live through someone else's life. Federer has to be this perfect God-like figure, because that is all you have. So when anyone tries to criticize him, you go ballistic because it's like they are attacking you.

Live your own life and stop insulting people who simply do not adore and revere Fed the way you do.

Maybe you are the one who just cannot deal with your hero losing. Fed let that match get away from him and it's something that he normally wouldn't do. But you will never address or discuss it. Instead, you persist in bringing up Rafa on a topic that is clearly meant to be about Fed.

Don't you get it even now? I don't care when you insult Rafa. You can't hurt him. All you did is make yourself look more and more disconnected.

The reason I gave up with serious countering points is that I noticed that you never answer mine or anyone else's. That's because you can't. You don't know how to debate and discuss honestly. You are just playing silly little game to make yourself feel self-important here. Not once have I seen you answer a question here. You just start hurling insults, because that's all you have. What a pity!

LOL.... Nativenewyorke...

1) I do not have to answer any people's question
2) This is not your website so I can post anything I like even if it offends your favourite player
3) Who cares losing 1 final to Delpo when Fed has won 15(more than double the active player is having now)
4) Call 1800-62626262626262 for Dr.Delpo

Ricky
1) Fed gave up which is why he lost a 5-setter while Nadal lost str8 sets and fought till the last point. Nice observation.
2) Rafans has been thrashtalking Fed so much and you are lecturing me? You are a very biased journalist.

torres, the point is that you are turning EVERY single discussion into a child fight. don't point the finger, the fault lies on BOTH sides. but when proper discussions are going, pull your finger out and stop being a DICK!! either enter it properly or stay out completely!

homos, it takes 2 to tango. I always start with posts that do not insult anybody but Rafans especially you will react childishly by attacking me personally or changing the topic.

Funny thing is you guys bash Fed all day long and then can't handle it when 1 criticize Rafa and point s out his faults.

If you can hit people, then just remember that people can hit you too!! Simple..

Torres,

Let us know when you get over Federer's loss. Until then, we don't need any of this nonsense.

Thanks.

ricky,

Let us know when you get over Nadal's ownage. Until then, we don't need any of this nonsense.

Thanks

Leave the kid alone
He didn't grow up yet & therefore you cannot discuss anything with him yet until he matures
HE IS FULL OF BS

I'd like to state, thank you to maxi, who on Tennis.com mentioned a few months ago I was a nice poster. Von , 9/11/09 11:13 PM

took me a while to find this one von. i dont appreciate the comments you are saying about me-just because i try to be objective doesnt mean i am noble-how dare you-who do you think you are?and dont tell me where to post either.probably posters are sick of your tirades on tennis.x so you come over here.
i promised alik that i wouldnt discuss tennis.x on TT. so much as he had enough.right. i didnt realise i mentioned it so much. i dont tho like your two faces von which are coming through your posts. yes. i do like to be objective.no. i am NOT ANSWERABLE to you. and NO. i havent posted on tennis.x for a few days because of the fights over there,you being one of the fighters. and i dont start any fights AT ALL, because i remain calm it disturbs you. so dont try and drag my name through something which you choose to get involved in von. and anyone who does post on tennis.x here, will know that it is similar/same to TT -a distinct federer rafa split-. It isnt "I love federer" site AT ALL . You forget sean randall isnt a fan and he is a key journalist there.you seem to have changed.am not interested in what you have to say right now.you are in a bad mood.get over it.
torres-native - right now, you are as bad as each other. i saw the link to rafa losing his temper torres.not pleasant.but all players do it.they are human.i hadnt seen rafa smash a racquet, swear in spanish, but it happened. move on. just wish things could be a bit calmer on this forum right now.cheryl/ricky can you write a 'moving on' thread please?
smartcuty since you been posting, you are causing a lot of problems between fans-you'l get caught out soon with your language and immature approach to posting. you are probably stating what some fans are thinking, which is why they like you.i dont like the way that responses are made right now.too much anger.not enough analysis about tennis.pity.

maxi: I'm not going to get into an argument with you except to state that the only reason I mentioned the quoted comment in your post above was due to your post on this site referring to me as 'crazy Von' a few weeks ago. If you will remember I asked you how could you say on one site that I'm a nice poster and then come here and refer to me as 'Crazy Von". Also, you proceeded to lecture me and it's the reason for my comments in my prior post.

Anyway, my apologies for having disturbed your calmness and I can assure you that it won't happen again. FYI, there are fights on every site, and this one is definitely no exception from the posts I've been reading here. FYI, Whenever, I have a disagreement with anyone on Tennis.X it's due to being targeted by another poster, (mostly the Federer fanatical posters) and then I have no choice but to defend myself. And, anyone reading my posts will see who began the attack. I'm a reactor not an initiator. In other words, i don't start the arguments, but I defend myself.

Wowww....so much has happened here ...
Its turned from Fed bashing to Torr bashing .....
You are one resilient SOB Torr ( all due respect) ...dont know how you do it .

Just one thing that struck me ...

"Also, I think to be fair to Federer, he played the second semi match and I'm thinking he had to be tired, as he mentioned in his presser, due to less amount of recovery time, which could be the difference in that match."
.........Von, 9/20/09 3:08 AM


Von , I respect you opinion ....but regardless whether its true or not ...Fed fans dont go down that road . Fed lost in a 5 set final to a player that played better on that day . End of story . I dont want to be one those fans that come up with reasons and i dont think fed even mentioned anything about this . Schedule was fine ...its the way the USO has always been . Nothing special or different was done . I believe Fedfans are better than the rest of them than to compliant about being tired for playing a semifinal that you need to play to make it to the final . Its just ludicrous ! Tired or not ...the semi's was part of the USO and not any type of extra match that he had to play . ..cheers Von .

Malt , maxi , zoey , tennislover, federites ...wassup ? :)

C'MON !

"Phoenix, go to the psychiatrist fast. You are imagining that you know me in real life... LOL..." - torres9 , 9/19/09 11:48 PM

hahaha. i gave this same advice to you and your pal maltymaxi in my previous life. here's a new advice for you:follow ricky's advice to get over fed's loss.

and get a life!!!

maxi,

You are not a moderator here, so please refrain from lecturing all of us on how to behave. I am not one who initiates an argument. But if I am attacked, then I will respond. I tried to make it polite, but if you are dealing with someone who continues to viciously and gratuitously attack you, then you don't have much choice. However, I have decided to ignore the person to whom you are referring. There is no way to win against someone who just argues and attacks for the sake of it. But I am insulted by having you say that I am just as much to blame. If you have been reading the back and forth here, then you will know who the instigator always seems to be.

The only thing for which I will take responsibility is allowing myself to be drawn into a no-win argument with someone who comes here merely to provoke and incite.

Phoenix, getting advice from a mentally ill person like you highly unadvisable.

Get a life and gf,bro

native, i dont lecture anybody,so chill.and also dont speak for everyone as well-and dont tell me what to do. your argument is with torres and it is disturbing for fans like me that dont like the argy bargy on this large scale.everytime i log on there is a continuing anger with you two.its everywhere right now.cant you take it on msn messenger or something? and obviously native,reading the above posts,zoey feels the same-so its not just me.you talk about the arrogance of federer fans,well the same is returned.its unfair on the reasonable posters out there.

von,i do actually feel that you are going slightly weird due to this comment:
maxi: I'm not going to get into an argument with you except to state that the only reason I mentioned the quoted comment in your post above was due to your post on this site referring to me as 'crazy Von' a few weeks ago.
-because if you remembered (a few weeks ago), i posted to you on tennis.x (as you said you wouldnt post here anymore,that i meant 'crazy' as in 'passionate' and you accepted that and apologised to me. now you come back and bring up the same thing over and over again?weird.for some reason you bring my name into discussions that dont concern me (like you did with duro), you will never find one post from me that has ever started a fight on tennis.x-not one.you shared with everyone your massive fight between duro and you,so dont preach to me about how to conduct yourself.thats your choicewhat you say and has nothing to do with me. You were nice,like i said,now, you just gone weird.you obviously want to fight for some reason.i dont.
fedex,i'm really looking forward to the AO,not long now and maybe we can get back on track,(as federer fans) cos right now,the posts are just not what they used to be.

maxi: As I said, I'm not going to argue with you. I also offered my apologies for disturbing your peaceful state of mind, on 9/20/09 @ 1:21 pm, therefore I don't think there's any need to say anything else from my end. Your points are well taken, even though slightly twisted and exaggerated, IMO, but I'll defer to you for the sake of your *peace*. I don't need to win an argument, which is not a *fight* IMO, also. A fight is where physical blows are exchanged and I don't see that happening between the two of us. I applaud you for not ever being involved in an argument, that's a record to be proud of. Wwhat a pity so many of us can't follow your good example; you're the epitome of calm and peace.

I've been thinking of posting on this site for a few months now because I like the writers, who IMO, are not biased in favour of one player, and write with more depth and analyses. Also, I wanted to get away from those fans of a couple of players who've targeted me because of some of my opinions, but I can see that this is not the place to be posting either.

Anyway, maxi peace, and I truly hope and wish everything will be peaceful for you wherever you go, especially on this site.

Nativenewyorker: "I am not one who initiates an argument. But if I am attacked, then I will respond. I tried to make it polite, but if you are dealing with someone who continues to viciously and gratuitously attack you, then you don't have much choice. "

Seems like the story of my life on another site. I've been viciously targeted and held up to ridicule leaving me with no choice but to defend myself, because of my opinions.

" There is no way to win against someone who just argues and attacks for the sake of it."

I can identify with this also. some people do this for fun and they enjoy it immensely. Sometimes, I try ignoring my attackers but they keep on coming at me relentlessly.

" If you have been reading the back and forth here, then you will know who the instigator always seems to be."

This is why I become offended when people reference an argument in which im involved, because they seem to read only bits and pieces of an argument and jump to a conclusion. I feel that before forming an opinion, someone needs to read from the inception and follow the whole scenario, then form an opinion, however, it's sad that this is not done, and the person defending his/herself is labeled as the trouble maker. Anyway, who said life is fair.

maxi,

I dislike your tone. I say that you are guilty of hypocrisy in the first degree. You are the one who is picking up what appears to me an old argument with Von from another site. So take a good look at yourself before you presume to lecture me. There is only one person with whom I have had a problem. If you have read a good part of the posts here, you will see that I am hardly alone in getting fed up and disgusted with that person. A number of people have told this person off in pretty strong language, so don't make it seem as if I am the only one.

As far as zoey, well she was the only one to criticize me, which was interesting, since she complimented me on my earlier posts. It seems that some will turn on you and do an about face the minute they decide that you are not writing what they would like to hear.

Your pious tone doesn't sit well with me. Since when did you decide that you speak for the so-called "reasonable" posters here? I haven't been here long enough for you to determine that I am continuously arguing with one person. This particular unpleasantness has confined itself to this topic. I am sick and tired on rabid Fed fans trying to insert Rafa into their argument to try and deflect attention from Fed's actions. This topic has absolutely nothing to do with Rafa, yet this person felt the need to expend the time and energy to dig up an old clip from 2007, showing Rafa getting upset over a hawkeye call. What, may I ask, does that have to do with Fed's tirade at the chair umpire in his finals match with Delpo? This is the kind of absurd character assassination that goes on all too often with Fed fans.

Given the great year Fed has had, why on earth would anyone feel the need to trash Rafa? Do they object to his very existence?

I did not come here to create havoc and your implication that this is my primary motive for being here, is quite objectionable. You don't know anything about me and obviously haven't bothered to read ALL my posts both here and on other topics. You have pretty much invited me to leave and I will say that I have no intention of doing that. You seem invested in your argument with Von, so I don't see that you have the right to accuse others of something that you are guilty of yourself.

still so much arguing everywhere!

Von,

I think you and I know each other. I am not using the same screen name that I did on tennis-x. But if I tell you that I was the one who you asked to stay on the site at least through the US Open, then I think you will know who I am.

It's interesting that we found common ground even though we didn't think we knew each other here. I am sorry that bad luck has followed you to this site. I know that there was someone who gave you a very difficult time and it was quite unpleasant. I see that you have caught up with someone who has called you out. I don't even know this individual, yet I am now public enemy #1.

It's interesting that you and I try to discuss tennis intelligently, passionately and respectfully, yet we encounter these types of people who insist on picking fights and then get full of self-righteous anger when we defend ourselves. It is more than frustrating. I think you know why I left tennis-x. It was too much to have to endure the cheapest of cheap shots directed at Rafa. I won't repeat it here, but it was the last time for me. At least here there are some dedicated Rafa fans who have defended him with pride and love. I don't feel as alone here. But still there are troubles.

As you can see, this topic was supposed to be about Federer's tirade in the finals of the Open. But it has degenerated into something very different. Why Rafa should even be mentioned in this context, I have no idea. But the Fed fans can't let go of their hatred for Rafa. They should be celebrating Fed's great year, but it always ends up being more trash talking about Rafa. What a shame.

My only intention was to come on here and join in the discussion. I did let myself get drawn into a back and forth with one person who is here for the express purpose of disrupting the interesting conversation. I have vowed to be more careful and not allow myself to get caught up in the hatespeak.

Nativenewyorker: Yes, I remember you from your great clues. I'm happy for you that you've finally found a site that's more Nadal friendly and can interact with some Nadal fans. Unfortunately, the waters have been muddied for me here which was not even my doing, but I won't get into a chronology of events that's led to my presence here, albeit, a very short one, and the present situation. It's time for me to move on, and find some greener pastures or maybe I should give up blogging altogether. What I find to be most difficult in posting, is not so much the attacks, but those who intervene and gang up with the attackers. The meddlesome people make matters worse, and is the reason why situations become blown out of proportion. However, I do believe that those people will get their just rewards eventually and be found out, but only time will tell....

Nativeny, take care of yourself and keep fighting the good fight for your player.

nativenewyorker, please spend your precious time and energy on more worthwhile matters. you deprive us of your wonderful posts when you waste them on certain numb-nuts! :)

back to tennis pls. stu is right!

homos,

You are right. I will take your advice. I don't know if you read one of my posts on the topic about Del Potro defeating Rafa. It was inspired by all the love from Rafa fans here. I will make sure to focus on the positive and have enjoyable, interesting, lively debates and discussions with some of the great people on this site.

I have learned a valuable lesson. Sometimes when you are fairly new to a site, it's best to read and pick out the troublemakers and choose to avoid them. I made an honest mistake and have learned from it.

You can be sure that I will stick to trying to give inspiration, hope and insight with all my future posts.

Thanks.

"Get a life and gf,bro " - torres9 , 9/20/09 10:39 PM

This was my advice to you. Come on torres, you can do better than that. If you have to be obnoxious, be original. :-)

back to the thread.........................come on everyone: any person who has followed the career of Roger Federer can be sure that he is not a vulgar or disrespectful man????????. just the opposite. ???????He was in a difficult moment and under a lot of pressure. However, he did make a mistake: who hasn't? - if not ask Serena Williams about this. WOW. ??????..Roger Federer made a mistake. Now that?s what I call human. Not superhuman, but human.

I have read a lot out there also that say Del Potro set Roge off with the "oh I wasn't ready" lie after a Roge ace????though the video replay clearly shows delpo in his usual pre serve stance, delpo out right lied to the umpire..........And then to Roge's surprise, and after the umpire clearly states "I didn't see it", the umpire gives delpo a replay of the point...............dah?...............C?mon!..................

Wha t?................ delpo's behaviour was not only unsportsmanlike but no-one seems to have picked up on that point either????????. Whether this was by instruction of his team,staff, mentors in the stands or of his own making, we'll never know. But it could be said of delpotro's improper and unsportsmanlike behaviour. Who really knows?.................

Roge is correct in that delpo should not be able to consult with his staff, team or audience in deciding whether to challenge a call. Calling for a challenge has to be immediate?????? For Potro to look to his team...............in the audience is wrong???????..

It's great that Federer was fined only $1500 for audible obscenities. because that is what the rule book says..........but..........He was totally correct to be upset when del Potro walked over to his chair, checked with his coach who told him to challenge, and then did. What's the time limit? Halfway through the 90-second changeover? Also, i thought coaching from the audience was ILLEGAL? Did the umpire do anything? No.

And the chair umpire is going to tell Roger to be quiet?............. ummmmmh....right. So, being a federer fan, he was right to be fined, but I don?t think there would be one person out there who (facing the same pressure in a grand slam final), wouldn?t have reacted in a similar way??????roger federer is still the best and doesn?t deserve this slating by anyone ? its utterly??..utterly, ridiculous. "S*t)" is not a vulgar word.(dir4ected at the umpire)..... One must also read the whole context of the sentence, it wasn?t ?aimed? at the umpire????.The US Open organisers have to give a fine to silence any critic. Roger is NOT....... an offensive or uncouth person, shall we ask all tennis players or non-players? The atp players know what a great role model he is in terms of manners/etiquette, and this ONE incident should not discredit that.....

native....i see that you are an analytical poster...and some of your comments i agree with...........i also got into a 'spat' with another poster once, and paid the price.......be careful.....your posts are mixed with both great sense, but also rage......would be a pity if you went............i am a passionate federer fan...love the guy........but have to be careful that my 'cupp....doesn't overfloweth!'. i think with experience.......comes a sense of 'knowing'......you seem to me to know a lot about tennis........i read your earlier post, where torres posted the link on rafa-i think that was his point........showing that the best players out there 'lose' it..rarely........but even rafa swore,smashed his racket and was furious............torres comes up with some pretty analytical stuff.....that i can remember........and dont think he means any harm......just a passionate fan..........like all of us.................anyway......moving on.........

federer fans UNITE for the AO! Move on.............
C'MON!

malteser,

I was very interested reading your passionate defense of Federer. You do make your case well, but in a rather excited, hyper way.

Regarding your observations of me and my posts - interesting reading. But the comment about rage seemed to be a bit much. I am passionate about tennis and Rafa. I offer no apologies for that. I am sorry if you interpreted some of what I wrote as rage. I have no hate for anyone here. Sometimes, we just have to agree to disagree and leave it at that.

I am trying to navigate my way here as a new poster a little more carefully. I am going to read comments thoroughly before I decide to answer. Maybe I will even take a moment or two to collect my thoughts. I dislike getting into ugly disputes with anyone and certainly did not come here to do that.

I really did try to find some common ground with Fed fans at another tennis site, but it just didn't work out. You love Fed and I love Rafa and maybe we won't see eye to eye on a lot of things. But I do try to respect opposing points of view. It would be awfully boring if we all agreed on everything.

You did give me something to think about with your defense of Fed.

i must have a different definition of rage :P

nativenewyorker, i read that. enjoyed it. wanted to post a comment but got busy.

Ricky...
if Rafa's sportsmanship is in a league of his own then why doesn't he ever win a sportsmanship award?
I'm not someone who would want ro bash Rafa,he's a nice and humble champion but he also DOES swear on court,(in spanish) and takes too much time between the points which is bothering for the other players.
to those who said Roger did it because he was losing...hello? it happened when the score was equal. the 3rd set 6-5! u think he's never been in that situation before??

btw,he wasn't mad that things were going against him(unlike Serena),he was mad because the umpire didn't stop JMDP from breaking the rules..and when Fed objected,he was told to be quiet( more or less shut up!)
Roger wins sportsmanship award because he's fair to the opponent...he won't win it this year but that doesn't take anything from the character he's shown.
he could have won this match ,and then with the VERY SAME incident ppl had less to say.

Come on, ppl, really..stop...this is becoming insane..same things repeated 10000000000 times...

All this talk about Rafa swearing in spanish - where? when? what did he actually say? Proof needed, talk is cheap.

As far as the sportsmanship award is concerned, of course Roger won it many years running, those were the years when he won everything and didn't need to lose it, as soon as he starts being challenged and being beaten he shows his true colours.

"Come on, ppl, really..stop...this is becoming insane..same things repeated 10000000000 times..."

Your point being? Broken records only make one tune.

Now back to the neverending whizzing match, already in progress.

People tend to forget that a good number of the top umpires speak spanish, surely, Rafa would have been found out by now. I don't think he would consciously think Oh, this umpire speaks spanish so I won't swear today, it's something that comes out if it's your normal way of expressing yourself, regardless of who is there.

Why is it that Roger cannot bear his cross alone, why should Rafa be dragged into this discussion. Some will soon be accusing Rafa of not shaking hands with the umpire and his opponent when he lost, or smashing his racquet.

carrie, that reminds me of a story in Martina's autobiography Being Myself. She used some choice words in her native Czech during an early tournament abroad. Following the match, two of the linespeople came up and greeted her... in Czech! They were just thrilled to talk to a countrywoman, but she was so embarrassed, she didn't swear for years after that.

Note "for years" - everybody lets it go at some time or another, and if anything the nay-sayers can be assured that the top stars do NOT get away with it. Johnny Mac was defaulted at AO 1990 - and later admitted that he had overlooked the introduction, for the first time at that event, of the 'three strikes and you're out' rule - it had been four up to the end of 1989. If anything this was an admission that he believed he was milking the system - i.e. he would not have had that last explosion if he thought this meant he'd be turfed out of the tournament. Many top stars have been fined since, and just now we have seen the winningest man and woman in current slam history being subjected to sanctions. If they're not going to arbitration about it, "end of".

Malt1 - THERE you are! As Bette Davis so memorably put it in All About Eve: "Fasten your seat belts, it's gonna be a bumpy night!" Let the fun (re-)commence!

carrie...
since when did 2008 become a year when Roger won the most tournaments?? Rafa was the best player of the year in 08 but the best sportsman was Roger.

phoenix...

apparently u believe there's a conspiracy that Fed -the most horrible creature ever created- won the SE sportsmanship award and prix orange 5 times in a row.
the players are the ones who vote for the winner and they know who they have voted for. those "poor sportsmanship examples" u brought all happened in 09 ,be sure Roger won't win the SE sportsmanship award this year.
btw,there has been other dominant players,like Pete ,but did they win so many awards? were they so popular with peers?? NO!
it's not like Roger has been cheating this year...he broke a racquet,swore( mad at the broken rules and the impolite umpire)....ok, poor sportsmanship and he won't win the SE award but ON COURT he's still a better sportsman than his main rivals!1

it's not just a number of fans who have seen through roger's accomplished tennis. jankovic hit out at him for his swipe at her, nole has had issues with him and murray lashed back at fed for criticising him for what the PRESS, not murray, did leading up to AO. fed has refused to shakes umpires' hands in losses, flung water bottles in his testy moods, let lose backhanded digs at his victors and now unleashed profanties when things weren't going his way. since things haven't been going his way, it appears players, not just fans, have seen his true colours. all those years when he could easily dominate a tour weak too in competition to worry him, he was nice. now...well...the story changes, and suddenly his fans are getting defensive of what is starting to seem like a series of unwanted attention.

You are missing my point, I first saw Roger swear at Wimbledon 2007 in the final that's when he started feeling threatened, and that's when the unsportsmanlike behaviour started, but maybe people tended to overlook it, because he had not shown that side of himself before. It just shows that the sportmanship award doesn't necesssarily go to the most deserving player, people voted on auto pilot.

You haven't answered my question as to when and where Rafa swore and what he said. I'm waiting.

niloofar, this is addressed to you:

You are missing my point, I first saw Roger swear at Wimbledon 2007 in the final that's when he started feeling threatened, and that's when the unsportsmanlike behaviour started, but maybe people tended to overlook it, because he had not shown that side of himself before. It just shows that the sportmanship award doesn't necesssarily go to the most deserving player, people voted on auto pilot.

You haven't answered my question as to when and where Rafa swore and what he said. I'm waiting.

homos...
don't go back to old stories. the Jankovic story was a misunderstanding due to the way the journos asked her the Q. before Wimbledon she wrote on her twitter that she wishes Roger to win. besides there are MANY players from WTA and ATP tour who have mentioned Roger's humility and kindness toward peers. Navratilova,Bartoli,Wozniacki,Henman,Agassi,Laver,Hewitt,RAFA,Lubicic, Roddick ,Blake ...are the few of them I remember right now.
I bet u have read their qoutes but u chose to shrug and ignore.eh?

carrie..
sportsmanship award is voted by PLAYERS. no cheating there. ok u think Roger's almost the devil, but can't he truely have won an award ?
I can't provide u the video of Rafa's swearing,and I don't know the exact swear word but it has been confirmed by spanish members,non-Fed fans ,etc.
in a world where ppl come out of the closet and claim Roger's awards and draws are rigged,I quite willingly accept from the internet users that Rafa also swears.I bet all the players do. I'm someone who never swears in public ,even in front of close friends but I garauntee that I would swear on a tennis court if I were a pro.
I have no reason to try to prove Rafa swears or what,it doesn't justify Roger's mistake. but the whole theory of :"RF is the devil,Rafa is a saint" is RIDICULOUS
I can't believe Native who says Fed fans bash Rafa more than Rafans bash Fed.
the hatred going on about Roger is appalling.

even if someday I conclude that Roger is an arrogant winner ,a sore loser, and a bad sportsman ,I won't be able to hate him as much as his haters do. they are just UNBELIEVABLE.

Basically, you can't substantiate the allegation, it's all hearsay. I know one thing for sure, Rafa has never been fined for swearing. Simply because people acknowledge that Roger's halo has slipped, you decide they hate Roger, not so, and Fed fans will not leave Rafa out of Fed's troubles. Rafa has got his faults, but so far swearing is not one of them.

Now let's put this topic to rest, I think we have sucked everything out of it. But I couldn't let your allegation go unchallenged.

First of all,

I believe that Rafa won the Prince Asturias award last year. I am not sure if this award is given by Spain, but it is for being a good role model for the sport of tennis. I have said this before, but it bears repeating. Anyone can be a good sport when they are winning, but if you can be a good sport when you are losing, then that to me represents true sportsmanship.

niloofar,

You persist in putting words in the mouths of Rafa fans. Nowhere did any Rafa fan say that Rafa was a saint or that Fed is the devil. When you put words in our mouths, then it makes it difficult to have a reasonable discussion. As far as my contention that Fed fans are worse than Rafa fans, I have more than enough evidence from forums that I have left due to inappropriate and vulgar comments about Rafa. That is one reason that I came here.

Some Rafa fans go to Fed forums and report back as to what is being said about Rafa. Why they do this I have no idea. I certainly would not subject myself to any of it. But some of the hatespeak that they relate on Rafa forums, is beyond disturbing. When it comes to wishing serious injury or death on Rafa, then a line has been crossed. I have experienced some of this hatespeak firsthand. That is why I have become selective about which tennis sites I visit.

I think it's fair game to question Fed's behavior in the finals of the US Open. That doesn't mean that people think he is the devil. My sense of Fed is that when things are going his way, he can be composed and calm. But when he feels the match slipping away or feels that he is losing control, that is when he also loses his usual demeanor.

I have noticed that both Fed and Rafa try to never reveal any negative emotions or feelings on court. They don't want to give their opponent the advantage. It's a good strategy. That's why it is of interest when someone like Fed loses his temper. Usually you can't even read any expression on his face. It can be argued that in this case it might have had something to do with Delpo and the fact that he said he wasn't ready for Fed's serve. You are supposed to go along with the pace of the server. Replays showed that Delpo actually was ready for Fed's serve. Fed served an ace and didn't want to replay the point. Then Delpo took a long time to challenge a call. I can see where there would be some reason for Fed to get upset, but the fact that he revealed the level of his frustration, just isn't like him at all. That could very well haven given Delpo a feeling that he was getting to Fed. Maybe that gave Delpo a psychological lift in the match.

What bothers me as a Rafa fan, is that somehow his behavior becomes the subject of the debate here, when the topic is about Fed. Whether or not Rafa ever loses his temper, curses, gets mad, etc., is not the topic. As a Rafa fan, I would naturally be offended by seeing his behavior become the issue of debate. Fed was the one who lost control and that is what we should be discussing. Some Fed fans have made their case in defense of his behavior. I can see their reasoning, but in the end I just think that Fed gave Delpo a mental advantage by losing his cool.

Get a life and gf,bro " - phoenix , 9/20/09 10:39 PM

This was my advice to you. Come on phoenix, you can do better than that. If you have to be obnoxious, be original. :-)

Nativenewyorker,

The reason why I put into the spot of Rafa's fault is to compare what is being viewed as negative for Roger does apply to Roger too.

If people want to talk about Fed swearing as a bad thing, it is a bad thing but not as bad as you guys make it to be.

And when you guys started to berate him for complaining in frustration, it becomes ridiculous. Even Rafa do not have the pressure that Fed has which is to win every game and Slam final so you can't compare Fed to any player for not able to be frustrated.

What I thought about the incident is that Fed was trying to say something as misintepreted the hand signal by the umpire. Big deal. Fed is the player's president and he was just saying something. Anybody would react angrily if you thought a guy is telling you to 'keep quiet'.

Nadal, Djoker, muzza, Delpo all have complained before. it's a normal thing.

And don't go on about Fed giving a mental advantage whateva. Delpo seemed like he lost it so many times but does it matter? In the end when the forehand is 110+ mph, does it matter what mental advantage u have.

What bothers me is people do not talk about the quality of tennis which is to me the best quality in USO2009 anyway but talk about this 3-minute thing.

The guy got fined. Get over it.

can I ask a question ?
can someone please tell me what was that point from the semifinal match between Djoko and Roger being discussed at the top of this therad?
where ppl claimed that Roger should have said sth but he kept quiet or what?
btw,can I kindly ask someone just for the facts and not hatred or bias added!
I 'll really appreciate it.(I can't watch videos on my computer otherwise I wouldn't ask :) )

"Even Rafa do not have the pressure that Fed has which is to win every game and Slam final"

what? Federer has the LEAST pressure in slam finals. He has already won 15, has won all 4 at least once, and is the all-time record holder. He has nothing to lose in a final. He even said so himself after the French and Wimbledon that he can play the rest of his career without any pressure.

niloofar - the point was when Djokovic aced Federer. After the ace, and i mean WELL after the face, the ball was called out. Djoker challenged and it was in. But they had to replay the point since it was called out, even though the call came well after the ace had already been completed. Some thought that Federer (or the chair umpire) should have given Djoker the point.

torres, since when has Rafa not been under pressure to win every game and slam final? It's these sort of claims that get people going about Federer to try to put all the god-like adulation into perspective.

Ricky ...thanks for the reply. :)
but is Fed in a position to decide on that? (I'm just asking)can he say: give him the point?
or it could have been what Janhavi said,that he didn't trust the Hawkeye.don't know.
***************
btw,I don't think Roger's tirade was due to pressure. he got mad at the rules not being enforced,and then the umpire neglecting him( the umpire should have at least made an attempt to silence the crowd instead of FED)...ok I'm getting sick of the times I've pointed this out.

hey nilloofar

i think the reason nole fans were annoyed with fed is because he was the only one who could say for sure that he would not have made the return even if the out call had not been made (the replay showed it of course). the umpire was just following the rules - when a good serve is called out, the point is replayed. a good sportsman would have conceded the point, but as someone mentioned, i think fed felt guilty later and tried to make up for it...

niloofar - of course! Players can give a point their opponents whenever they want to.

I'm not saying should have, because Djokovic is probably the only player who would actually do it. But yes, Federer could have given Djokovic the point that Djokovic deserved.

one last question and I won't bother again...:)
where in the match was that?
tnx.

"in the end I just think that Fed gave Delpo a mental advantage by losing his cool."

Good call, native. Shades of Johnny Mac blowing a two sets to nothing lead to Lendl in the French final in 1984. He shudda won the Grand Slam that year.

niloofar,

i don't believe in conspiracies, i don't care who voted the fed the best sportsman 5 years in a row. to me he's an arrogant, despicable person. period! don't try contradict that! that is my opinion, and no fed fan can ever change what i believe. GET IT?
ARROGANT, DESPICABLE!!! ENOUGH ALREADY!!!

regardless of what player(s) you root for, I think we can all agree that this is awesome:

http://www.gototennisblog.com/2009/09/21/video-roger-feder er-sings-for-switzerland/

This was my advice to you. Come on torres, you can do better than that. If you have to be obnoxious, be original. :-) phoenix , 9/21/09 9:20 AM

This was my advice to you. Come on phoenix, you can do better than that. If you have to be obnoxious, be original. :-) torres9 , 9/21/09 9:41 PM

hahaha. Need I say more? This graduate student pretender is at a loss for words, and have to 'steal' from a high school drop out. :-)

Oh well, what can you expect from a FED fan.

This was my advice to you. Come on torres, you can do better than that. If you have to be obnoxious, be original. :-) phoenix , 9/21/09 9:20 AM

This was my advice to you. Come on phoenix, you can do better than that. If you have to be obnoxious, be original. :-) torres9 , 9/21/09 9:41 PM

hahaha. Need I say more? This pretender is at a loss for words, and have to 'steal' from a graduate student. :-)

Oh well, what can you expect from a RAFA fan.

RIcky, good article. Anyway, props to Djoker for giving the point to people who deserves it. But I think(in my opinion) when Delpo asked for the point to be replaye for the ball boy moving, the serve was a sgood as an ace to me. So Delpo should have given the point to be fair.

So Fed is not a bad player for not doing something that requires probably a deep thought but it's just that Djoker is very very nice to do have the awareness to do it.

So probably, Djoker should be given the Sportsmanship Award this time?

Fed has the least pressure to win another Sportsmanship Award because he has won it 5 times in a row, and also won it on clay 5 times in a row. :D

There is a new kid in town

Phoenix,
Aroogant & despicable is nothing to the true face of the biggest AH in all sports ever
Days will show him more & more especially with the upcoming losses & detoriation of level due to age
Wait till you see his heart eating more & his face exploding expressions of hatred to everyone but himself

Haha....
Just wait for Rafa, biggest Bore in tennis world to be overshadowed by exciting new players.

Only one thing will remain: Achievements of the GOAT. :D

Yes, one thing will remain: the smell of the ARROGANT GOAT!!!

Ricky, thanks for the link.

I agree, it's great to see Roger as a 'civilian' enjoying himself and showing team spirit. Perhaps if we saw more of players in mufty, we wouldn't be so rigid in our opinions of them as people. Let's face it we don't really 'know' them as people.

VAMOS RAFA!

Ana and Rafa receive the International Tennis Writer's Ass Award:

Rafa and Ana have been voted ?Ambassadors of the Year? by the International Tennis Writers Association.

Rafael Nadal of Spain and Ana Ivanovic of Serbia have been voted Ambassadors of the Year for the 2008 tennis season by the ITWA membership, an honor designed to recognize consistent openness and cooperation with the world media. The two players will receive solid-silver hallmarked letter openers, engraved with their name and ?ITWA Ambassador 2008.?

ITWA past president Neil Harman said: ?We understand that the players can?t grant every interview request, but Ana and Rafa have been exemplary in their professional dealings with the media. Rafa is always scrupulously polite, while Ana always seems to have a smile on her face, even when talking to the media after a defeat. They are great role models for their fellow players, and we hope their engraved letter-openers can find a small but proud place in their trophy cabinets.?

This is what the media thinks. No ifs, no buts.

thanks for the post carrie. now brace yourself and take cover.

phoenix ...

funny!
I didn't tell u anything disrespectful, but look at the way u responded to me with all those "GET IT?",. funnier than that in your next post u say"...that's what u can expect from Fed fans"
my problem is that the majority of Fed fans(unlike what Native thinks) can bring themselves to say a few (or more) nice things about Rafa although they might not even like him a whole lot. ( RF.com is full of ppl who do not like Rafa but they have nice things to say about him as well)
look at torres, u all accuse him of bashing Rafa but there has been many many times when he said sth nice about Rafa or accepted that he has his own nice characteristics too. but that doesn't hold true for the majority of Rafans who dislike Roger( maybe u could exclude F4T)....and don't tell me it's because there is nothing positive about him.
when there are facts that u can't refute ( like the sportsmanship awards +NUMEROUS commenst from peers,former players,etc. about him being a nice guy),why don't u just accept it, instead of going to such an unfriendly mood which is quite apparent in your response to me.
for the most part the discussions going on, on this forum is about Fed ,and not even about his game but his character mainly.
btw,no disrespect, but that 's a very stubborn statement saying that no one can change you mind. it sounds like : " I don't want to change my mind"
I'm a FEd fan and I have very convincing reasons to love the Fed but I would never think I'm 100% right about him.
nothing personally against u but ,no need to be so aggressive. :)

If you go on Rafa's website, you will not find a single negative or hate comment about Roger, Rafa's fans are just like him - nice people.

i have been on fed's website forum a number of times and i've read some very nasty comments made about rafa and andy murray (i'm guessing these two for obvious reasons). a lot of fed fans use very vulgar language or abreviations and that are obvious what they mean. someone told me what they were saying and i wanted to see it for myself rather than take her word. i should have just taken her word. but the other players threads do have some articles and photos that i don't find elsewhere so i tend to check those out.

I'm sorry niloofar. You are right, my aggressive post was uncalled for. I should remember not to blog when I have a little too much to drink.

I'm sorry. :-(

carrie......two points...........

torres posted a link (I think on another thread)...dubai 07.............where rafa ........d-i-d swear in spanish............... d-i-d smash his racquet.........d-i-d argue with the umpire.....plus the TV channel guy said..........."Rafa is furious". (twice). go watch it. it's there.

secondly, i have read a fair few posts over the last few days, and you still seem to blame roger for e-v-e-r-y hateful poster out there -believe it or no..........roger cannot control what people say about rafa.............- If you say that "Rafa's fans are just like him - nice people -

quote: If you go on Rafa's website, you will not find a single negative or hate comment about Roger, Rafa's fans are just like him - nice people.
carrie , 9/22/09 4:04 PM

where did you go wrong carrie?
because i dont think you have been remotely nice about roger for ages................ - you still blame him for everything -

Gorafago...........great to see you man too.............there you are!!!!!!!!

native.............loving your posts.........and don't go anywhere! you write longer posts than me!! **mexican wave** whoop!!! whoop!!!! I dont expect you to agree with me - we are polar opposite................doesnt matter...............

I have seen the video that torres gave the link to, no one can hear what Rafa said, that he was furious there is no doube and he did put his racquet down in anger, but he didn't smash it. There is no need to tarnish Rafa with Roger's misdeamenors, because he's got his own faults, I know he is not perfect.

I think Fedfans encourage adverse comments, because they make claims that smply do no stand up. Now, I think Rafa is the greatest tennis player since sliced bread, and I think he is the most watchable player around, I cannot understand why 'everyone' can't see his many qualities, but that is far from assuming that everyone loves him. Some of the things that some Fedfans say, indirectly attack other players, such as everyone loves Roger, and he is the GOAT, those sort of claims just annoy someone like me, because it's effectively saying that no one love the player you support, and that their achievements do not count for much.

Actually it was cheryl I was defending Rafa against, not Ricky, but I understand the point she was trying to make, there again, I just didn't see why Rafa should have been drawn into Serena's problems, when other players commit their own offences. Rafa always seems to be targeted as if to say he does this and that as well, probably because he comes across as the choir boy of tennis.

I think Rafa is the greatest tennis player

sort of claims just annoy someone like me

So in this case, we Fedfans have the right to feel annoyed too.

I cannot understand why 'everyone' can't see his many qualities

Same as me, I dont see why Rafans always talk bad of Fed when he has as much good qualities as Rafa has.

Rafa always seems to be targeted

Nope... Roger is the one getting targeted the most here.

carrie......rafa s-w-o-r-e in spanish. It's very clear. If you want to be in denial about it - that's fine. your call..............

and let's face it. ........................ we are n-e-v-e-r going to agree - so that is O-N-E T-H-I-N-G that we will only agree on.

and i think you said in one post i read a couple of days - which did make me smile - that you are no 'mother theresa'. well............yeah.........i'd agree with you there carrie. so actually...........that's two things we'll agree on....................

Federer is the greatest, will always be................i support him until i die......i dont care...........i love the guy.................

torres you are right..........roger is the one that ALWAYS gets targetted..........and I am sorry carrie..........but i remember v-e-r-y............... c-l-e-ar-l-y...at wimbledon this year.............when you posted negative article, after negative article about federer.............sending your message loud and very clear to all federer fans, how much you hated him, disliked him, couldnt stand him.........calling him names (smugalot.........arrogant......etc)...and you call yourself one of the 'nice rafafans'.....no way..........not ever........nothings changed since i've been away, no softening of your tone.......just more of the same........time and time again.........

Fed is smug, and he is arrogant, and Rafa gets called names like fake showboater and fake punk, it's all par for the course.

It's not enough to say that Rafa swore in spanish if you can't actually say what exactly he said and how it translates into english that I understand, or most posters here understand. Unless you can tell me what he said, the case is not proven.

PASSING SHOTS

I'm not the only one who thinks Roger is smug:


KING OF SMUG: ROGER FEDERER HAS NO CLASS
In Federer, Laver, Nadal, Sampras, wimbledon on July 5, 2009 at 5:57 pm

Those are words I thought I?d never type. But his post-match speech was revealing. Pretty pathetic praise for Andy. I heard no words about how great Andy played, nor did I hear much respect for Pete Sampras. Just a few words about wishing Pete would show up at Wimbledon more? Shame on you Roger. Shame, shame. When Tiger beats Jack Nicklaus? record, you can bet he will have a lot to say about the man he just surpassed. But Roger has been reading his press clippings. He thinks he?s better than everybody else, couldn?t even bother to name ?those guys? that Andy immediately recognized. You know, Borg, Santana, Rod Laver?

So to sum up, this was not Roger?s greatest moment. You got lucky, Rog. Rafa Nadal owns you. The computer says you?re #1, but that too, comes with an asterisk.

Much love for Pete Sampras for refusing to concede Roger is the greatest ever when he?s standing next to Rod Laver, who won 2 grand slams and would have won many more if he hadn?t turned pro to feed his family. Pete is right that Roger has the numbers, but as I?ve written many times, statistics don?t ell the full story. And I love that Rod Laver said hey, Roger is the best in his era. He is, at least for now. That ought to be enough.

I'm an American and I love and support our American players. Pete was my No. 1 fave and now Roddick is my No. 1 fave, but I've got to be honest I lost some respect for Pete for showing up at Wimby. It was obvious whom Pete was supporting and I'm sure it had to have hurt Andy very much when he saw Pete there. Pete and Andy were friends before Federer came onto the scene and befriended Pete during his California showing a couple of years ago.

I've seen Rod Laver many times on the Tennis Channel in interviews, and when asked about who's the greatest topic, he always responds that a player can only hope to be the best in his era.

I've been looking around for a site to post that discusses several players, but it seems that his site is pretty much split down the middle Nadal fans vs. Federer fans. Anyone know of a site where fans of other players post? This is a sincere question, because I feel like odd man out on sites that are predominanty only Federer/Nadal inhabited. Any suggestion would be appreciated, because I love tennis, but I find it extremely difficult to comment when there such an obvious split and I don't like taking sides.

carrie's losing the sanity.. haha

Djoker and Andy M said that Fed is the best ever. Nadal too. I think a lot of the players agrees because no one plays like The Fed.

malteser,

You made me laugh and that's quite an accomplishment these days! I haven't posted for a day or so and it appears that things have been quite lively here.

One of the things I love is being able to have a lively, spirited debate with someone who happens to be the polar opposite of me. I find it to be great fun. If everyone agreed, then things would get pretty boring around here. I love the argument.

As long as we can manage to keep it fairly civil and somewhat polite, I look forward to the challenge of debating you on any number of issues. I do tend to write long posts, but not intentionally. I try to edit myself, but I can wax poetic at times.

Anyway, here's to a lot of craziness and arguing all it the spirit of free and open debate.

Nativeny: Please read my post at 11:20 pm, do you know of any other sites where there's a mix of players being discussed? I'd appreciate any suggestions. Thanks.

Von,

I know about tennis.com. That's one I got from a Rafa forum. I think there were others, but I would have to go back and check. I have been over there and it seems okay.

I did go back and read your post and it seems so sad. I thought you were okay on tennis-x.com. What happened? You had some really great friends who supported you. I thought you were a fixture there.

Also, I don't see why we can't discuss other players right here on this site. I have no problem with that at all. I know there are a few Nole fans here. I can't remember who you liked. Was it Roddick? I think it comes down to Roger and Rafa because of the topics and also because there is this great rivalry and so much intensity among their respective fans.

You know why I left tennis-x.com. There seem to be a lot of great people here who are knowledgeable about the game. Maybe you should hang around and check out the blogs for discussion about other players. I certainly have no problem talking about Nole, Murray, Roddick and Delpo. Of course, Rafa is my favorite, so I could talk about him all day long.

I hope things are okay with you.

pehaps we should have individual player pages, where all discussion about that specific player can go

(not including discussion about specific matches, which obviously belongs on a match report)

Ricky,

That's a great idea. Von has a lot to contribute regarding both the game and the different players. I would certainly love to see her feel welcome here.

I would certainly be happy to participate in different pages devoted to other players.

Thanks for the suggestion!

Ricky, no need for that. If you want different pages, just go to the official websites of the players.

All right, I have something good to say about Fed. After that magnificent 2008 Wimbledon final for the ages, Roger was talking about playing Rafa and he said that Rafa had him thinking out there. Then he said - the great ones always make you think. I feel that was one of the nicest compliments anyone could every pay Rafa. That showed the respect Roger had for Rafa. I have always remembered it. When I get mad at something that Fed says about Rafa that seems kind of negative or one of those famous backhanded compliments, I try to remember that other comment. It's not easy to have something nice to say after a tough loss. Was that the real Federer?

Rafa had equally complimentary things to say about Roger, but then he has always shown him the utmost respect. These two champions seem to have a much better relationship with each other than their respective fans. We always seem to be at war. But sometimes it's nice to just dial it down a bit and say something nice.

We can always go back to fighting again.

torres9 - I think you missed the point a little bit. Thanks for the tip though.

"Ricky, no need for that. If you want different pages, just go to the official websites of the players."- torres9 , 9/23/09 6:36 AM

As usual, always contradicting just to gain a bit of attention. :-)

carrie, in case you hadn't figured this, i am not your interpreter. You'd have to pay me lady if you want me to interpret it in spanish for you.............but do keep up the pretence...........its funny.....................It's obvious. ....................................there is even reference to it in a write up on the incident................. if you dont want to go and do your own research, read the articles, believe what was reporte by the guy who actually commented on the match.............. thats your problem. I do notice though that whenever you dont like anyone criticising rafa, you say........'case closed'............how convenient for you...........and nice to know that you are extracting spiteful articles about roger again................ For every spiteful one you post, you become more and more the fan that you say you despise...................'the nasty fans'...and yet you contradict yourself. ................... you say that rafa fans are 'nice people'. where are they carrie?.................... cos they certainly dont live in your area.

native..........i'm glad i make you smile.....its been a long time since i have done that! feels good!!!!!!!!!
thanks for the nice comments about roger, even though you are a...uh hum...rafa fan...............but if you were a real federer fan (which i i know you are not)............. you would know that rafa and roger have the utmost respect for each and roger knows what a 'phenomenal' player rafa is...his words.................you should go check out some of his interviews native, they are very clear for all to see/hear......massive compliments. problem is 'some' rafa fans.....you will have worked out who they are........want roger to get down on bended knees......probably want roger to retire now and get out of tennis and cannot appreciate what he has done for the sport.....that aint ever gonna change.....i lose energy sometimes........reading posts that offer nothing except contradiction...........

but native, i watched the youtube vid on roge again that ricky posted....i love it man....i love it! he..........uh hum...........'almost human'. whoop! whoop!
i love the guy.......love him! i love roger federer.......de...doooo....dahhhh.....day! yeah baby!!!!!

sky....where are you?
zoey, girlfriend........where are you?
fan4tennis...yes....i admit it.......I MISS YOU!

c'mon! allez federer!

ricky, you will then need to hire 2 mods for each of the top four player's blog to ensure discussions are closely monitored 24/7 and the site doesn't crash! :P

malteser,
the reason I posted that article is to show you that my opinion of Roger's smugness is not only mine. I like to see evidence and back things up so until I see the evidence of Rafa swearing, I'm just not prepared to accept hearsay. I couldn't hear what Rafa said in the video, otherwise I would get it translated, but you say you heard him swearing in spanish, that's why I asked for a translation, you can tell me what he said in spanish. Also you can't blame me for holding an opinion of Roger that is universally recognised.

Why call my criticism of Roger nasty, that's a very emotive, unpleasant word to use, Rafa gets criticised by Fedfans a lot and gets called all sorts of things, but I will never describe any of them as nasty. I am by no means a nasty person, but I do have polarised strong views about things, and I also defend my corner with zeal, but nasty, no! If someone is smug and arrogant, there is nothing nasty about that. You just find it hard to understand that not everyone is enamoured by Roger, but I accept that not everyone is enamoured by Rafa, even though I can't understand why.

Von, try Tennis World; They cover all players including the WTA.

VAMOS RAFA!

carrie, the issue is that there are some who simply cannot accept that there are opinions out there which vary from theirs and that it is people's right to have an opinion. therefore if they don't agree, they get offended and attack. i think some fed fans identify themselves so closely with fed that they take any attack on him as a personal attack on them. it's a very interesting phenomenon. it borders on scary imo. i wouldn't worry too much about people calling your opinion nasty. it's pretty clear who are the more sound and rational ones.

Pretty clear Rafans are the ones who jumps the highest when Nadal gets criticized by a Fed fan. It's a very interesting natural disaster it borders comedy tho imo.

Here comes the demented attack dog. You're getting predictable torres.

getting? phoenix are ok?

Here comes the demented attack dog. You're getting predictable phoenix

torres, ay least be original.

Ricky: a good idea but how would it work? I've noticed here threads about specific players always get posts about other people, quite often derogatory, though not always.

malteser,

I don't want Roger to retire just yet. I want Rafa to have another chance to beat him in a grand slam final! Hah! I know you will just love that comment. A real Rafa fan would have the confidence and belief to welcome another confrontation with Roger. These two bring out the best in each other. It's more like a duel or a chess game when they are on the court.

Count me as one who wants Roger to stick around a while longer. I don't know that other Rafa fans want Roger to literally get down on bended knee to Rafa. I think they just want him to lose to him! All in good fun here.

Admin: I just wrote a post and it got chewed up. Is there anyway to retrieve it? thanks.

My post which got chewed up in gist stated:

I'd like to thank Ricky, Nativenewyorker and carrie for their responses to my posting dilemma. LOL.

Nativenewyorker: I'll try to stick around and keep a lookout for other topics on which i can post. i did so on the Davis cup thread. Failing that, I'll go back to my old site because I'm a creature of habit and don't like moving around from site to site. You asked what went wrong on Tennis.X, nothing really. I just got tired and/or burnt out from some of the personal attacks due to my opinions from some posters that's all. Maybe, after a while, I'll go back there, because as you've pointed out, I do have a lot of support from my friends there. In the meantime, I'll keep you company here. I like some of the discussions here as they seem to have insight and depth to them.

carrie I'll try to check out tennisworld.

Nativenewyorker, we have something in common. I lived in NYC where I attended NYU. After which I moved in 2000 to sunnier climes and balmy beaches.
** **************

homos: @ 9/23/09 1:30 PM, I agree with you that many posters forget that every poster has a right to his/her opinions and as such should be allowed to write them. I've sadly encountered this problem, which is one-sided, and it's one of the reasons I'm looking for a site that allows freedom of speech and expression of one's opinions. However, I'm realizing that this is an Herculean task as this seems to be the MO on the other three sites I've visited, where some can freely voice their opinions and others have to watch every word they utter.

With respect to some posters taking comments personally and living vicariously through their players, sadly, this is also a fact. In some cases, some posters seem to cloak themselves with their player's celebrity status and feel they have celebrity entitlement., whereby they adopt the attitude that they are a cut above the rest of the posters because their player is a top 4 player . This, I'm also beginning to realize that's the norm across the board and is not pertinent to any one site but just the mindset of some posters. i suppose we'll all have to learn to work around such problems.

Von,

Great to see you here! It's true that I was born in New York, but I have lived in the sunny climes of L.A. since 1980.

I know what happened on tennis-x., but I thought you could just hang in there and keep going. I don't know why these things happen to intelligent, reasonable people who just want to have an intelligent discussion and disagree respectfully.

You had supporters on tennis-x. I didn't. I had one horrific fight with someone who again posted that lie about why Rafa withdrew from Wimbledon. That was the last straw for me. I will not argue with anyone who persists in making totally false and inaccurate statements about Rafa.

I agree that there is a dilemma when you are a huge fan of a particular player. I have to watch that in myself when it comes to Rafa. I don't know him as a person, but having listened to so many of his interviews, I have discovered a lot of qualities that are admirable. I also know that he is all too human. Nobody is perfect, nobody is a God, not even Fed. Even though some Fed fans would wish it to be so, the truth is that our hero tennis players are flesh and blood human beings. They make mistakes, sometimes fall short of greatness, and have human failings.

I don't confuse myself with Rafa because we are very different people at different points in our lives. I am middle-aged and have experienced a lot more of life than Rafa at the tender age of 23. He is from a different culture. But I love his humility, sportsmanship, good humor and most of all, his intense desire to be the best he can be.

I left tennis for a few years because I wasn't inspired. Even though Fed is a great player, I didn't enjoy seeing him just walk over the competition in every grand slam. There is no thrill without real competition. In 2007, I finally decided to watch Wimbledon, just to see this young man named Nadal that everyone was talking about. From the moment I saw him, I had this rush of adrenaline, chills down my spine, suddenly all of the excitement that had been missing was there once more. I knew he would be one of the truly great players. I have seen all the greats over the years. I grew up with tennis and have watched it all my life. I don't get that special feeling all that often. I knew Rafa had what it takes to be a great champion. From that point on, I was hooked.

Nativenewyorker:"Great to see you here! " Thank you for your warm welcome.

""I know what happened on tennis-x., but I thought you could just hang in there."

"I don't know why these things happen to intelligent, reasonable people who just want to have an intelligent discussion and disagree respectfully."

I think only those people who target others can answer your question. LOL. I can only speculate that there's jealousy involved in some cases due to popularity and insight of one's posts . I've yet to see some posters comment on anything worthwhile except to pick on some targeted posters. What I don't understand is why anyone should be upset if another poster's comments are too long and/or too frequent, and/or with whom they interact. It's mind-boggling to me, and extremely childish. Hence, the only explanation I can find is jealousy.

I know what you mean about some players stirring up your adrenalin. I like to see players who have a certain presence and exude electricity. It makes me want to watch tennis and feel as though I'm part of the excitement.

I loved Sampras and was somewhat lost tennis for a while after he retired until Roddick won the USO, and then I got hooked on Andy. I'd love to see him win Wimbledon which is his heart's desire. I'm not one for numbers, and I only support players for their appeal as opposed to their talent. But, as the saying goes, to each is own, isn't it, and my own is Roddick.

carrie, ay least be original.

Von,

Good for you with your choice of Roddick! I hope you get a chance to find some Roddick fans here and chat with them. Everyone finds the person that they relate to, whose tennis moves them in some way. To each his own. You have seen how passionate I can be about Rafa. But I am also interested in other players. I think Roddick's resurgence is quite compelling. It's great to see him playing some of his best tennis late in his career. It's unfortunate that he got knocked out by Cilic, but his attitude was wonderful. He knew that he gave it his all and fought until the last point, but on that day Isner simply was the better player. His coach has done wonders with his confidence and mental toughness. I believe that it's important to be able to just say that in that one match, on that one day, in this one instance, the other guy played better. Murray hasn't been able to do that yet. I think that may be part of his problem. If you can't say that you were outplayed, then you are going to have mental blocks and obstacles to success. It's important to acknowledge the defeat and move on to the next tournament. But if you insist that you just didn't play your best and give no credit to the other guy, then you can never learn from your mistakes and cannot progress and get better.

I am sure that Roddick would love the chance to win another grand slam and Wimbledon is certainly a worthy goal. It would be nice to see him remain competitive and in the mix of top players. But Delpo is in the mix and it would appear that he is a force to be reckoned with now.

The challenge for Delpo is for him to continue to play at the level he did at the Open. If he can keep that up, then he is certainly a very real threat in a grand slam.

Von,

I have to correct a typo in my previous reply to you. I inadvertently said "Cilic" in one sentence, but correctly put Isner in another sentence. I am sure you and Roddick will remember that it was Isner who beat Roddick.

torres, at least be original.

I have to put in a word here for TT. I have been on many other forums, but I feel most at home here because they do have a long leash and tolerate free speech as long as it is not offensive or insulting. Some forums tend to be too sterile by only allowing benign comments.

There are oppotunities for a wide range of discussion here, it's just that it always comes down to Rafa and Roger, and any thread that's not to do with them is ignored. At the moment, these two players appear to be the be all and end all in men's, and I'm afraid everyone else just has a walk-on part. In the real world, any tourney that doesn't have these two in the final is not considered to be such a success.

VAMOS RAFA!

phonix, at least be original

von, thanks for your respose. i agree with you, but i think it's a vicious cycle that will keep circling. firstly, it's no fun to have your own blog with a small no. of people than it gets incestuous in a sense. but i've to agree with carrie that tt is more varied but you aren't ever going to get a perfect forum/blog - that would require perfect human beings to participate. but player-focussed forums can be a bit weird too.

i've visited tennis x but never joined the forum, never thought much of the site. it sounds like you had a rough time. that's not good. maybe the answer is to forum-hop, i don't know.

more importantly, i'm pleased to see you were a sampras fan. so was i. but he copped some bad press too, huh? he was pretty introverted so the media shrugged him off as boring and turned to agassi for more gossip :P even nike initiated controvery between them. i didn't like agassi in his first phase but after his comeback, i was such a big fan that it left a hole when he retired, which for me rafa has filled big time. a pity that hewitt, roddick and safin could not do more and prolong their threat/dominance for longer. i think the game surpassed hewitt and roddick and the only predictable thing about safin was his unpredictability. tennis became a bore after that. also when the williams dominated, i fell out of women's tennis. but i think we're lucky now with men's tennis to have more competition and potentially more coming up. it keeps you on the edge of your seat when you can no longer say "aahh, so-and-so is going to win, i'll just switch it off and check the score tomorrow". now you HAVE to watch the match! at least we have that.

If you go on Rafa's website, you will not find a single negative or hate comment about Roger, Rafa's fans are just like him - nice people.

carrie , 9/22/09 4:04 PM

how about that Federer venting thread on RN.com?
btw,If you think "nice ppl" don't post hateful or negative comments about Roger so what is all this hatred on this site?
of course some Rafans are nice ppl, some are not(same for Fed fans),but the majority of Rafans hate Roger which means they are NOT like Rafa AT ALL.(they may be nice but they're not like Rafa). Rafa has called Roger "humble",do u have trust in your man or not?

and about what homos said that there were nasty comments on RF.com,yes there are at times comments that may be unfair but honestly I don't think that there are many of them that would go beyond questioning Rafa's injury,or making fun of his habbits or attires( btw,u see the same ppl saying sth nice about Rafa in another occasion),whereas my problem with ppl who attack Fed is that they attack his integrity as a person,which at times may be really heartbreaking and overly cruel.

phoenix ...
I have no idea if you meant your post or not,but anyway no problem! :)

niloofar, what you call 'venting' is simply people stating the facts.

If you cry at someone else's party, or you swear in full view of the camera, or you don't shake your opponent's hand because he beat you, you can't expect people not to say so. That is quite different from saying I hate this or that person. I have never said I hated Roger, or even that I don't like him.

carrie............do calm down dear............this is all so silly...........you really do take things out of context where roger is concerned.................he said sh*t - NOT aimed at the umpire..........he was sat in his chair when he said it........so what..........rafa was sat in his chair when he swore as well at dubai......so what? its just that we treat them like martyrs. they are not.........thank the lord......oh praise........oh my.........what a wonderful revelation that federer is human......and hell..........can THAT boy sing! go:fed:go...................

Mini..........i disagree with earlier post.......federer did NOT swear at umpire..watch the vid again....he was sat down when he said it......questioning the uncertainty/unfairness of the rule....just accept that he had a point.......paid the price..........move on............federer has..............by singing away to all and sundry at the swiss 'hog maney'..........
i love federer carrie and i am sick of you going on and on about this..........state the facts...........so what if he cried.......he is an emotional guy...........i would love it if he cried tears of joy, or tears of pain........you conveniently forget........how within 20 seconds he got himself together after that wonderful gesture from rafa (will always love rafa for that - friendly arm around shoulder) at AO.... but you put sterility into emotion carrie..........what is wrong with you? is your heart so full of cold and made of stone? my god woman...........seriously..........love a little............give a little empathy...........do you know what that is? PLUS..........rafa cries too, dont ya know? yeah carrie he does.......really........so please...............grow up on this one and please........change the goddamn record.....................grand slam final/delpotro wrong to be allowed to challenge- no matter what you say.....................grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! carrie! grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! even the channel.........said 'surely too late for delpo to challenge..............go check it out again.........but really............M-O-V-E..........O-N.............otherwise therapy for you carrie...and i would hate for you to become more embittered...............really.

Hi Homos: Glad to hear you were a Pistol Pete fan. I loved his running FH which to me, is still the best in the sport. I think Pete was more of a let his racquet do the talking guy instead of following the glitz and glamour type, and it's why Agassi was considered the media darling and not Pete. Somehow, Andre never found his way to my heart as Pete and Roddick have done, but nevertheless he is an American and I support all of our players.

I agree with you that the sport has bypassed Hewitt, but I still feel that Roddick has some more years left in him to hang on in the top 10 and perhaps win his second GS title. He's came so close this year and it must have been heart-breaking for him to not win the title, but I'm hoping that he won't become discouraged and hang in there to win that elusive GS. I know his heart is set on Wimby but right now I think even the AO would suffice as his window of opportunity is slowly closing. Anyway, with life there's always hope, hence I'm hoping ....

I was only responding to niloofar.

OK malt, I love Roger, and I think he's great,...........will that do?

By the way, Rafa didn't swear.

von: roddick definitely has more tennis in him. but i do wonder if he can win another slam. i think everthing has to go his way: draw, schedule, even a bit of luck, and he has to be riding on a lot of confidence. it took me days to get over my sorrow for him after wimb. i felt so, so bad for him. he gave it everthing til the end. you couldn't fault him for giving up or folding. i mean that 16-14 will haunt him forever. i sometimes wonder if it has some similarities to how conners felt losing to jmc on super saturday but wimb 08 final could be overshadowing most epic matches. still, you gotta give to roddick considering the crushing H2H against roger.

so you were no agassi fan even til the end? i did take to him in a big way when he came back after his break but i must say, i don't think i quite forgave him for indirectly calling pete a monkey thanks to nike of course!

well ao will be around the coner in a blink. will you be routing for roddick than?

homos: That Wimby final 16-14 keeps going around in my head all of the time. The same with Andy's loss vs. Isner this year at the USO. I keep thinking two (2) measley points in the tie-break. I do believe Andy had the toughest draw and I just didn't think he'd make it past the QFs, but Isner made even that impossible. I was mad at Isner for days.

"well ao will be around the coner in a blink. will you be routing for roddick than?"

LOl, you don't know me, I'll root for Roddick long after he's stopped playing professional tennis, like I do for Pete during his exho matches. Anyway, to answer your question, but of course I'll be rooting for my Andy Roddick with all my heart. LOL. I'll root for Nadal too, but only when he's not playing against Roddick.

ATP rankings of Fedhaters on TT:-
1) carrie 11,000,0000 pts
2)homos 1,4568792 pts
3)phoenix 556782032090 pts
4)memi 83728100pts
5)f4t 2222pts

carrie...

I heard there was a THREAD called "Federer venting" on RN.com,and once I visited RN.com ppl were talking about the idea of having such a thread,apparently it's deleted.and ppl don't need to come out and say:"I hate RF" ,just look at the adjectives used to describe him on this thread ,it's tells u all.( they're entitled to do what they want but I'm just stating a fact).
btw,when didn't Roger shake hands with an 'opponen' after a loss?? he FORGOT to shake hands with the umpire after losing in Miami( I know it's not ok but he FORGOT because nothing controversial had happened in that match),and I have seen matches where the winner forgot to shake hands with the umoire so it happens. and it's diffenert from 'refusing' to shake hands.

btw,you didn't answer my Q,what do u say about Rafa calling Roger "humble"? do u trust Rafa or not?

LOL....torr....

but you forgot mr. ricky ; he is the hugest fedhater defender! :D

niloofar, here is your evidence, do you call this shaking hands?

http://tennisplanet.wordpress.com/2009/01/09/federer-vs-murr ay-doha/

Look, I don't want to go on with this argument about who did what, we both think our players are the best things since sliced bread, let it remain so. We are not going to change each other's mind so let's agree to disagree.

Oh yea, Rafa says Roger is humble, he has to be diplomatic, I don't. I have no reason to think that Roger is humble.

ohhh, everybody knows Rafa is for real, the biggest Fedfan.....too many examples to mention; only a blind, bitter old fedhater would deny such an obvious fact.

hey malt, hope you are doin' great!

I love you carrie..................AND HE DID SWEAR!................

Zoey.......lovely, have written you e-n-d-l-e-s-s posts..........but you dont reply :( to me..............i love you zoey.......where have you been?

where is fan4tennis? AGF? Mdmuch? Senorplaid? they all gone away.............

where is sky?..................

zoey............will catch you tomorrow..........know you are up and about and bouncing around right now..................time for bo bozzzzzzzzzz for me..........nite zoey.............
Federer! Ooohhh...Ahhhh........Fed-er---rarrrrrr!!! rah! rah! rah! (smiling)...sorry guys...truly...cannot help it......................

C'MON!

mwah malt! just busy...and we have this time zone difficulty....lol....certainly meaning to reply and still a tt member....lol

Fed is the Best!! malt...unbelievable that he makes a mistake and it's blown waaaay outta porpotion on tt....somethings never change here. i'm back to work. later, lovely malt!

torres, what's it like being acrid?

malt, you need help to get the Fed out of your head.

carrie...

Rafa was not "asked" about Roger's humility,he said it himself.
if u still think he didn't mean it,and just said sth to have sounded nice then u 're claiming that he's fake.

and about your evidence: it says "not found"...
I don't know what it is,but I highly doubt that Murray came to net and Roger would refuse to shake hands. I follow all Fed's news,and I NEVER heard that,so I doubt it's the way you're claiming.

"phoenix ...
I have no idea if you meant your post or not,but anyway no problem! :)" - niloofar , 9/24/09 2:54 PM

I meant it, niloofar. You are one Fed fan who's relatively level headed and polite in your posts. If I have done it to torres, there's no way that I'll apologize.

niloofar: have been following Andy M for years and if Fed had ever forgotten to shake Andy's hand at end of match it would have been all over British press.....and it wasn't....

niloofar, I've heard Rafa say very complimentary things about Roger, without being asked and I have no doubt that he has great respect for Roger as a player and a person, but I am not a slave to Rafa and I don't have to agree to everything he says. He, obviously, knows Roger better than I do, but based on what I have seen, I would call Roger a bad loser, because at the end of the day, that's where his grumpiness stems from. Everytime Roger has crossed the line it's always when he is not winning, normally he is fine. I think even Roger will admit that he is a bad loser, maybe that's why he is a winner.

I've just been reading Rafa's genuine account of his career so far, and he really does respect Roger, he almost seems to accept being No2 to Roger, maybe because he knows he is a great player, and sees him as a big brother.

niloofar, since you insist on carrying on this discussion, here is what someone on another thread called Three Putt has to say on the subject:

'Why is Federer still praised for his sportsmanship?

I wonder why commentators keep praising Federer for his sportsmanship. It used to be good. Today, his behavior is not always so professional. He reminds of his pal Tiger Woods, who acts like a real a-hole when things don't go his way.

Even before he went all ape sh*t at the umpire yesteday, Federer has twice refused to shake an umpire's hand (Doha v. Murray, Miami v. Djokovic). That is unprofessional for anyone, especially since Federer is considered a great gentleman. What Federer are people seeing?

He also pointlessly interjected himself after a Karlovic Wimbledon match, saying Karlovic didn't play a real tennis match after serving 40+ aces. Then in the Wimbledon final, Federer served 50 aces! Was that "real tennis"?

Federer should not get the Stefan Edberg sportsmanship award this year. No way! He is not a great sportsman any longer. Santoro, Blake, Nadal are all much gracious in defeat'.

deuce... thanks for the clarification.as usual, you're fair to players who are not even your favorite. :)

carrie... Roger may have been not been a good loser 'at times',but not all the time. he could have won this match against JMDP and then u wouldn't be saying this. when his outburst occured I for one had not paniced about the match AT ALL.
btw,forgetting to shake the umpires hand is different from refusing to,
both are unacceptable but the former doesn't make me think of him as an impolite person.
again, swearing because u 'feel' disrespected is different from swearing because sth went against u. both are unacceptable but different.

I have huge respect for Rafa but I wouldn't consider him deserving for the SE award either...and really don't want to discuss him here.
I don't know which KArlovic match you're refering to,ppl on message boards say all sort of things,what I know is that this year he was asked if Ivo is boring and he answered quite nicely,calling the journo unfair.
and...I know you're not Rafa's slave :) ,but when you consider him a genuine AND humble person,u should give a little credibility to his opinion about Roger.
and I don't know why ppl worry about Roger winning the SE award,he won't win it this year IMO,even Edberg didn't win it every year. no big deal and don't worry!:)

is this what its all about ? ...the SE Sportsmanship award ...oh god ...take it ...have it ...i just want the AO10 next ....all the rest of the players can take all the awards till AO10 ....hahaha......oh god ...5 times in the row seems to be Fed's curse ....i dont think that is an issue ...he can skip the sixth then take the 7th to 11th all again :P

C'MON !!

lol fedexfan. I think anyone would want Fed's 'curse'. WInning 5 in a row and losing 1 final is a 'failure' LOL

It kinda could be consider a 'failure' for somebody like Federer, torres. After all, we are talking about the guy who's supposed to be the best player of all times, aren't we? This year he made it clear he's not done at all, so loosing against a 21 year old AND during the first GS final of that 21 year old could be consider a failure in a way, don't you think? Not that it happens so often.... Not against somebody like Federer in a year where he almost win it all.

alba , i like that you have such high expectation for the Fed and that for him to loose to JMDP is not acceptable to you . I would have loved for him to win . Seriously . However , a loss is a loss . But what makes him the greatest to me is his achievements overall . Just taking this year ...he not only played , but was in the finals of all 4 GS's and won 2 of them . Thats just insane ! The GOAT (IMO) is not someone who does not ever loose ; everyone has to loose and im sure many would agree that you cant win 'em all no matter how good you are . The goat is the person with the best game and best achievement in the period of his tennis career ...there are a million more factors that many would add ...i frankly i dont want to go through the whole GOAT discussion again as I think im just too tired ....

But let me answer your question with a question ...you posted on the 'Tennis Idol' page that rafa is king of clay ....

Question :
Is he still king of clay considering he lost the FO09 in the fourth round to someone he beat 6-1 ; 6-0 just a few weeks before . Not only was that NOT the final ....it was not even a 5 setter ? For some reason he is still the king of clay to you ...am i right ?
Tables have turned ...

Me , I think he is the king of clay . You need to take a step back and look at the whole picture . Not just ONE particular fact ...not just one match ...the whole thing ..he is the best on clay . Now tell me ...( and this question is for alba only !!!!! ) ...who do u think , in your opinion is the greatest of all time ? step back and look at the whole picture ....

cheers alba ...i like ur post and the way you think .

C'MON !!

Hi, Fedexfan

My only way to answer your questions is: Yes, Rafa is still the king of clay to me, the same way Federer is the best player of all times, till someone proves it wrong. As a Rafa fan I would LOVE for him to prove this wrong, but right now... Federer is the GOAT. That's the way it is an even rafans like me are able to see it and I have no problem admiting it.

What I was trying to say in my previous post is "with great power comes great responsabilities". I agree with you, Federer can loose because he's human, but if he wants to continue being the superhero of tennis, he cannot loose. Or at least not against the 5th seed in his first grand slam final.

carrie - BLAKE gracious in defeat?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA

Ricky, that was not my post, I explained that it came verbatim from another site, it was written by someone called Three Putt. I agree with the general thrust of it, not to the letter. I have never ever considered Blake in this context, or Santoro for that matter.

oh ok, gotcha. Well Blake by all accounts is a great guy off the court, but he is a horrible loser.

Djokovic has to be No. 1 in terms of most gracious loser.

oh ok, gotcha. Well Blake by all accounts is a great guy off the court, but he is a horrible loser.

Djokovic has to be No. 1 in terms of most gracious loser.

RickyDimon , 9/25/09 6:55 PM


What, over Rafa???

I agree with Ricky, Blake's a nice guy off the court, (most people are when they are not placed under stress) but a very ungracious loser. He blames his losses on everything, even the commentators, and without a doubt, the fault lies within himself. I suppose next he'll blame the ball boys for his losses. LOL. I think Blake should call it wrap for his career as a tennis pro, should be dropped from the US Davis cup Team, and go back to Harvard to finish the 3 years left to complete his degree. The one occasion roddick was not able to play in Davis cup and Blake had a chance to show he couldobtain a live rubber win, he lost, and blamed the loss on a toe problem.

Ricky: what about that quote, can't remember who said it but: show me a good loser and I'll show you a loser.
carrie: have watched that clip re Doha, to be honest neither player looked too keen on a fond embrace...

OK malt, I love Roger, and I think he's great,...........will that do?
carrie , 9/24/09 6:58 PM

carrie...sarcasm or no sarcasm.....i'll take it honey! oh yeaahhhhh!

malt, you need help to get the Fed out of your head.
carrie , 9/25/09 9:21 AM

carrie......am past the point of no return.........no antidote for me.......nothing will work........a lost cause...................but dont you think that you need help to get rafa out your head? (pssttt.......I LIKE THE WAY YOU SAID.........'T-H-E'...F-E-D...though carrie.........made me go allllll gooooeeyyyyy!!!!!!!!!

zoey....hope work is good........am really worried about fan4tennis though.......where she gone?

I see the discussion is as lively and heated here as ever. But I found myself thinking as I read the posts from Fed fans in particular. Is it really all about the records for you folks? The most this, the most that, the greatest of all time. Is that it? Because I think there's more to being a great tennis champion. Being able to lose graciously doesn't meant you like to lose or are a loser. Rafa said something I keep thinking about in his post match press conference after his shocking fourth round defeat at RG. He said that it's necessary to accept both the wins and the losses with gratitude. He also said that losing makes him realize just how precious it is when he wins. There's a lot of maturity and wisdom in those comments from a 23 year old young man.

Maybe losing helps you to realize what it means to win. But for Fed fans, it's all about the stats, the records, the GOAT. Everyone knows that you can only be the greatest player of your own era. It's impossible to compare great tennis players from earlier times to today's players. But it doesn't make them any less great. Why Fed fans must insist that he is GOAT, I have no idea. Maybe because Roger wants it to be so. But nobody can ever truly be GOAT. The argument itself is absurd. Why can't Roger just be one of the greatest tennis players? What's wrong with that?

Rafa is still young and has time to set his own records. I am confident that he will do that. I think his greatest chapter is yet to be written. It's insulting to say that Fed is the best and no one can ever top him. We will see. But whatever Rafa does, with or without the records, I will always admire and respect him. People will remember him and the fire and passion he brought to the game. People will remember his generosity of spirit, kindness, humility and decency. They will also remember that fierce will to win, like nobody else. That mental toughness that makes him play every point as though it is his last.

There are other things for which great champions are remembered and revered. I think some Fed fans have lost sight of that in their unending recitation of numbers.