Wow I am truly amazed by so much fan favorism by your hand Cheryl.
I can totally relate now to what is and has been happening on this site.
Nice job Rafatica.

Every tennis writer on the planet is biased because we think Yannick Noah is out of line. Right.

If all it took was the magic potion, why is Spain nowhere to be seen in athletics, rugby, cricket, boxing etc. It is the most baseless, ridiculous accusation for anyone to make.

Noah needs something concrete to back his statements up, because he pointedly accused the Spanish. Seems like Sienna is letting her dislike for the Spanish )and other nationalities cloud her judgement in a lot of her posts.

"Is Spain sharing the magic potion with Novak Djokovic, Andy Murray and Roger Federer too?"

That sums it up.

Sigh....................why are we still talking about this nonsense issue?

I will never understand why someone who keeps saying that Cheryl and this site are biased in favor of Rafa, continues to post and whine about it.

Anyone who has read Cheryl's blogs knows that she has enormous respect for Fed. I don't see any bias in that regard and anyone who does, is really just trying to stir the pot. It's a baseless allegation.

Just because Cheryl doesn't subscribe to the lunatic ravings of one Yannick Noah, who has not one shred of fact or substantive proof to back up his allegations, does not make her biased, it makes her reasonable.

There is a lot of criticism of Yannick in France, including from the French Sports Minister who branded the accusations as serious and irresponsible.

Cheryl,

You didn't discuss the most absurd part of Noah's interview, the part where he said doping should be legal for everybody so everybody's on the same footing. Why does he assume everybody would want to take the same health risks?

numero -- I purposely didn't discuss it. I have another blog planned to discuss the foolishness of making doping LEGAL. Insane, really. We'd have players dropping dead of heart attacks on court. Good idea, Yannick.

"If the ?magic potion? was all it took, Guillermo Canas and Juan Ignacio Chela would surely have dominated before they were caught."

Wasn't Canas cleared of any wrongdoing? I thought he was eventually cleared because the banned substances were in medication prescribe to him by an ATP physician.

Quinn, point taken. I should have chosen Mariano Puerto.

when and with what was Chela caught?

Noah has been flinging accusations, naming names, and banging the drum for legalising doping since the early 80s. By offering up the admission he himself smoked pot before matches (he claims up until 81 and we are expected to believe he then stopped) apparently, in his eyes gives, gives him the right to be the self appointed spokesman on the subject and to tarnish the reputation of many illustrious names in the sport. Bear in mind these revelations first appeared - not in the national press or even the tennis press but in the music journal Rock and Folk which is the French equivalent of Rolling Stone.

It will be interesting to hear what his long term doubles partner, Guy Forget, has to say about this recent outburst from Yannick who more than likely was as high as a kite when he gave the interview to Le Monde.

We've established that Noah was well out of line with his comments, especially by directing them at a sole nationality.

I'd still like views from Ricky, Cheryl and the rest about the ITF's anti-doping directives and their results-management programme. WADA only conducts the testing, disclosure of names and results is up to the ITF.

Great article Cheryl - very objective. However, some people do not deal in rational thinking so you will never get past their bias no matter what evidence you put in front of them.

If say Rafa had taken the magic potion how come he has one of the slowest serves on tour and also does not possess the fastest ground strokes in spite of his "muscular" physique. Less muscular players have much bigger serves and ground strokes.

Ricky - Chela tested positive in 2001 for an actual steroid (it was synthetic testosterone). It's actually one of the few cases in which they found an ACTUAL PED in somebody's system. Usually, it's a banned diuretic, as in the case of Canas.

samprallica - I'm one step ahead of you. :) I downloaded the ITF handbook on banned substance testing and I'm reading through it. Mostly a bunch of mumbo jumbo, but there are a few gems in there. My second blog on doping will address my findings.

schatz - thank you. :)

What puzzles the average layman like myself is how easily the authorities accept the ' players version of how banned substances have entered their system. As long as they can come up with a story (however implausable) the edict of 'beyond all reasonable doubt' is allowed to prevail.

Puerta received an 8 year ban because it was the second time he tested positive but most of the others either had the length of their ban reduced or waived entirely.

Ed, I thought the same thing. Canas, for example, claimed that the diuretic he tested positive for was administered to him accidentally because he took medicine for a sore throat. I may not be a certified doctor, but I'm pretty sure a diuretic would not help strep throat.

It's all very strange and dicey and the deeper I delve into this, the odder it all seems.

I don't know how many of you have read the blog that puts a different spin on tennis, doping, and the ITF/WADA transparency. It is worth a read because the person who manages the blog has put in some effort to substantiate some of his claims that all is not what it may seem to be.

I guess you'll have to read with a very open mind though, especially if you are a diehard fan.

Sampra...is there any link? Where to find it?

Read with a very open mind, zare. Most allegations are based on speculation (not unfounded though), but the issue of how transparent the WADA/ITF is is properly laid out. More than anything, the blog shows us that the organisations are not doing all they can.

http://tennishasasteroidproblem.blogspot.com/

Sampra, I have read your link with a very open mind and all I can say is, you have not read it with said open mind because you've chosen to believe people who say what you truly feel.

First off, Rafa's response was specifically to do with Noah's accusation about Spanish tennis players not spanish sports in general.

In tennis, there are 13 spaniards currently in the top 100 and three in the top 10, against 10 french players in the top 100 and one in the top 10. Is that such a big gulf to warrant the conclusion that Noah has come to?

The one player who has put Spain in the limelight in tennis is Nadal, there is also one player who has dominated from Switzerland, and the two other top 4 players come from Serbia and GB. Where is the logic that Spain is so dominant. If what Noah says is true, the top 4 should all be spaniards and the top 10 should comprise mainly spaniards.

Spain was whitewashed in the DC last year by France and no one accused France of cheating.

The one spanish player who has dominated tennis from time to time is universally being called a claycourter. If PED's played a part, then why doesn't he dominate on all other surfaces?

The claims being made are totally inconsistent with the reality, and it is purely from jealousy because France would like to be Spain in tennis.

Finally, from time immemorial, one country or the other has dominated tennis. Australians, Americans and Swedes have dominated in the past. When this crop of spaniards retire, there will probably be domination by another country.

Incidently there is no spaniard in the WTA top 20 and just one in the top 30.

What do you make of that?

The French are hyper-sensitive because the Spanish have dominated Roland Garros by winning the title 11 times since Yannick won in 1983. What's more I dont think any French Player has progressed beyond the QFs in the past decade. That's what rankles with them the most.

Umm, no Nadline, I don't possess any firm belief that there is cheating going on, all I'm saying is its possible. If you actually read the whole blog, you would find that the ITF/WADA aren't really transparent about how they go about with their doping regime, and that they don't properly account for all the missed tests in 2009 - and the document that carried that list was later altered. That is a bit fishy to me.

I don't agree with everything on the blog, nor will I ever target Spain as the sole culprit, the main reason being that the true big fish in the game are from four different nationalities, not Spain. Some of the allegations they've made are based totally on what they perceive to be drug use because of how players perform or how their physical appearance is structured. That is all pure nonsense.

But there are interesting news reports, interviews, and material showing correspondence with certain organisations that show that things don't seem entirely right. There needs to be a lot more transparency.

The lack of transparency doesn't only affect Spain and talking about the build of players, you might find that Monfils and Murray could give Rafa a run for the size of their biceps. Name me any other tennis player who has big biceps.

Just look at Rafa's Dad, he is chunkily built, so why is anyone surprised that his son is not a stick insect.

Corr: Name me any other SPANISH player who has big biceps. If it was so easy for them to take the magic potion why don't they all do it. Verdasco and Lopez have been around a long time, two very good talented players who have failed to scaled the heights. What's stopping fro cheating if they know they'll get away with it?

Nadline, like I said - I don't agree with everything on the blog, especially speculation based on player's physical appearance. Only steroids lead to bulking up, the other drugs don't.

Also, I never said that malpractice in tennis (if happening) was unique to Spain. I think it'll be quite a few nationalities - considering that the top players arent Spanish only. There have been suspicious incidents in Spain though surrounding other sports (cycling) - and there are always double standards, so I don't think it is a surprise that it comes up.

sampralica, you are shifting sands all the time. Maybe you should stop pursuing the subject because it makes you sound like you agree with Noah.

Sampra for goodness sake don't bring cycling into this discussion. The whole sport is been based on doping. In fact I dont see how anyone could even contemplate riding the TdeF etc. unless they were doped out of their brains!!!!!!

Shifting sands? I don't agree with Noah's statement as a whole. The case of Dr. Fuentes is fact though.

@ed, well it helps that cycling is a lot more transparent with their disclosure of information than the ITF is. I mean, imagine if cycling operated in the same way as the ITF (no disclosure of names of people who cheated, secretive bans etc).

shame he was a funny man..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTtTFV0jXuk

^^^Thanks for the link.

This video clearly demonstrates why the time limit between serves was introduced. It was simply due to these sort of antics by certain players. It was never because they thought taking 5-10 secs longer than your opponent to prepare to serve was of any advantage.

@nadline yeah, thanks. but you can take a look at this one and check how much time Becker spends on first and second serve, it's lame and unacceptable for us now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3rGPOde5Ss

Don't you just love the shorts the wore in those days. Sampras was the one who introduced the long baggy shorts.

Cycling is like almost no other sport. To win big in requires entirely different things than to win in soccer golf or tennis.

Cycling at the top level boils down to in great part whether you can take more excruciating pain in your body for hours on end than your competition, both in training and in competition. Not something 99.9999% of the population is remotely interested to subject themselves to for years on end. Lance Armstrong won the Tour de France many times because he has been able to take all that pain.

^^ That is quite true. I am backing the players on this - I don't think they are doping, but I do want the ITF to publish results and answer their critics. That is important if they're serious about retaining the sport's integrity. Or else, the whole thing about changing the drug testing regime will look like a PR stunt.

@Nadline. yes Pete introduced the baggy shorts somewhere around 1994, definitely looked better on him than the tight, short ones. So much for people saying Pete didn't make a statement with his clothes :D

Another ignoramous has nothing but circumstantial evidence. Ever heard of genetics? Why don't you research the circumstancial evidence surrounding the beast of Barcelona - that should shed some light on the matter.

MRM's 7:23PM comment should be taken down.

http://espn.go.com/tennis/story/_/id/7278594/yannick-noah-says-doping- talk-meant-wake-call

What about blood doping and HGH? They don't lead to bulking and are more useful in endurance sports like tennis. Those who take these drugs don't get tired easily and are less prone to injuries. If they do get injured, they recover fast. HGH is supposed to be anti aging.
ATP doesn't have very reliable tests for blood doping and nothing at all for HGH. ATP has excellent tests for performance enhancing steroids which lead to bulking. Also funnily for cocaine. So, stars who use steroids are more likely to be caught than those who blood dope or use HGH. (ATP has no tests for HGH and HGH does not cause bulking).
There is a site which claims tennis has a steroid problem and it really is a joke as it presents all kinds of unscientific facts and publishes photoshopped pictures of tennis stars it suspects. As it cannot deny that ATP has reliable tests for steroid PEDs, it makes unsubstantiated claims that ATP is concealing positive tests based on the fact that it believed Agassi's claim about his positive test.
we could carrying this analogy further make the absurd claim that ATP has no tests for HGH because it doesn't want to catch any big fish.

^^^HGH is no magic bullet. See Wayne Odesnik please. Remember he was caught in the airport transporting it.

Incidentally HGH reduces abdominal fat. Since Roger was accused on the other thread of having a 'pot-belly' then it would seem that he doesn't use it. Watch out for the ones with the cut abs.

http://espn.go.com/tennis/story/_/id/7278594/yannick-noah-says-doping- talk-meant-wake-call

Nadal said Noah should be banned from commenting in the media, while Pep Guardiola, the coach of Barcelona soccer club, told him to produce proof or stay quiet.

"I went through the same thing 30 years ago, when I was 20. I spoke about doping and drugs and everyone had a go at me," Noah said. "I couldn't respond to everyone. To Toni Nadal, Rafael's uncle, who's told his nephew never to say hello to me again. But what do I care if he says hello to me or not?"

T even tells Rafa what of what not he should do.

I like the follow up from Noah.

^^^Yes I thought that was funny too. Rafa doesn't say hello to me either. What do I care? :)

I thought everybody knew Toni tells Rafa everything to do right down to the scripted press conference responses. He probably picked his gf too. I'll bet you anything he was mad when Rafa went to throw up against Fish because he ate too many cookies. Fie for shame on you Rafa!

Since Roger was accused on the other thread of having a 'pot-belly' then it would seem that he doesn't use it. Watch out for the ones with the cut abs.
numero
, 11/27/11 3:07 AM


Ooops, touched a raw nerve did I? It was not an accusation numero, it was an observation................even you cannot deny that Roger has a pot-belly, and you confirm it in your above post!

Not going to join in this 'war' about doping, but that comment about Toni telling Rafa what to do right up to not saying hello to someone really make me laugh!

If only Rafa would listen to Toni, and skip some of those tournaments, like Rotterdam, Madrid....we won't be talking about someone surpassing Sampras slam record here! So much for Toni telling Rafa what to do and what not to do and Rafa following instructions obediently!!

There's no need to bash Rafa in this manner just to make Fed looks better than he is. Rafa can make his own decisions and speaks what he wants to speak. Certainly no sane people would believe Toni telling Rafa to be negative during press conferences during RG. That speaks more about these said people's own sanity than Rafa's supposedly obedience towards Toni.

Oh yes, that was an illuminating response from Yannick Noah! What a joke! He sounds so defensive and rightly so, because he is probably getting it from all sides. He blew it totally with his baseless, groundless, biased allegations aimed solely at the Spanish players. If all he's got in response is that Uncle Toni told Rafa never to say hello to him again and that he doesn't care if he does or not, then this guy is even more of a joke! Nice way to deflect the attention off of him and onto Uncle Toni and Rafa. Oh, poor Yannick Noah! Rafa's Uncle told him never to say hello to him again. How awful! Of course, Rafa obeys his uncle without question. More propaganda!

Methinks Yannick Noah dost protest too much! :)


This guy should go back into whatever hole he crawled out of and stay there!

If we take Mr. Noah's comments to their logical conclusion, we would say Richard Gasquet is a lousy kisser!!

rafaisthebest..um don't think Rog has a "pot belly" I think TV distorts a bit, am always surprised when I see Rafa (;)) how slender he looks, yes really! I think Rog's body shape has definitely changed with age and he looks much more wiry these days. Also darling Andy looks almost stocky, which he clearly isn't, because his body strength is in his lower body, whereas Rafa's is in his upper body. I think that's reflected/distorted by the camera.

@MRM , 11/26/11 7:23 PM

Cheryl seems to have gone AWOL. Sanctioning of this site is not effective if people can say what they like whilst Cheryl is not on duty.

Strange body types some of these tennis players. Ok deucy, maybe it's not a pot-belly Rog is sporting (pun fully intended) but he ain't cut either! The same goes for Kvitova and Dinara Safina.......................as for Nalbandian, 'nuff said..............

With all the running and explosive bursts of speed they subject their bodies during matches and training you'd expect them to be all buff......................

I think people are born with the body they've got and whilst exercise could be effective is controlling body weight, it's impossible for Serena to be like Venus for instance because they are different body types. The non playing siblings of the Williams sisters are quite big and Serena seems to have inherited that side of the genes but Venus seems to have inherited her body type from her Dad.

I often wonder how someone like Serena could be so heavy inspite of the amount of exercise she takes simply by training and playing, but she only has to relax for a couple of weeks and it will all come back, because she is not meant to be slim.

Rafa is slim in the flesh and his biceps are not as exaggerated as people would like to think. The bulk on his left arm is due to use in playing, even Rod Laver's left arm is bigger than his right arm for the same reason. Rafa also trains to get strength in his left arm. He descrbed in detail how he achieves this in his book.

Yep, I saw Rafa in person. He's alot more slender in person than when you watch him on tv. He's taller, slimmer and darker than what we saw on tv.

^^^^^^So they coined the phrase, "tall, dark and handsome" with him in mind then?

I suppose so RITB. I watched Rafa played tennis since he's an eighteen/nineteen years old. To me he was such a sweet and beautiful boy back then. Now he has grown into a handsome young man. I still miss that teenage boy, the wild boy from Mallorca. He's certainly more carefree and happy back then.

See, I knew this Agassi thing would come back to bite the ATP.

Nadline, I didn't go AWOL and this thread, except for about 5 posts is fairly tame considering the topic. I was simply traveling on Sunday and catching up on a back-log of work on Monday.

Luckystar@10.38am - I too was very close to Rafa and a lot of the other tennis players when they were on the practise courts at Indian and other courts apart from the main show arena at Indian Wells and I was really surprised at how much smaller and thinner they were in real life too. Rafa is not that big really and I would even say that Feli Lopez is more of a presence with his broad shoulders and strong physique.

Thanks Cheryl for removing the offending post.

Yanick Noah i only voicing his opinions, and nothing's wrong with that. Let's just say Noah has the guts to talk about stuff some pundits feel but are gutless to do otherwise. The candals with the good Dr. F, is not gossip, it was determined to be a fact and the list contained the names of many prominent Spanish athletes, some of whom are tennis players. It's obvious why some athletes are upset, but that's too bad. As the saying goes, do nothing, fear nothing. Thus, if the are not guilty then Noah should be allowed to speak without being subjected to such repercussions.

Well scoretracker is back and even before reading his post I guessed what he would be saying - so predictable really.

I had hoped that your ban would have given you a chance to reflect on the tone of your past posts but I see that you are just as adept as ever at twisting things to suit your purpose.

Would someone be kind enough to give me information as to how I can contact the moderator(s) of this site. Thank you.